lordroel
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Post by lordroel on Jul 8, 2023 16:27:35 GMT
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Post by Max Sinister on Jul 8, 2023 20:01:52 GMT
I haven't read this yet, but looking at the first map in this thread I see that while Czechia is part of the western block, Greece and Norway did become Communist. Which means that the Soviets will have access to the Atlantic and the Med. Will this become a topic in the books?
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lordroel
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Post by lordroel on Jul 8, 2023 20:11:02 GMT
I haven't read this yet, but looking at the first map in this thread I see that while Czechia is part of the western block, Greece and Norway did become Communist. Which means that the Soviets will have access to the Atlantic and the Med. Will this become a topic in the books? No, only what is mentioned in what is called EXCERPT FROM WAR’S FINAL FURY, BY PROFESSOR JARED GRUENWALD. It is all to us what will happen next, but i think, Norway and Greece in return for a united Germany pro Allied country is a small price to pay, even if the people in those countries might see otherwise. |
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Post by Max Sinister on Jul 8, 2023 20:52:00 GMT
I haven't read this yet, but looking at the first map in this thread I see that while Czechia is part of the western block, Greece and Norway did become Communist. Which means that the Soviets will have access to the Atlantic and the Med. Will this become a topic in the books? No, only what is mentioned in what is called EXCERPT FROM WAR’S FINAL FURY, BY PROFESSOR JARED GRUENWALD. It is all to us what will happen next, but i think, Norway and Greece in return for a united Germany pro Allied country is a small price to pay, even if the people in those countries might see otherwise. I'm no expert for this kind of AH, but IRL the US & NATO were concerned that the Soviets might get a foothold in these seas. Russia's always been a land-based power, but still. |
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lordroel
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Post by lordroel on Jul 8, 2023 20:58:43 GMT
No, only what is mentioned in what is called EXCERPT FROM WAR’S FINAL FURY, BY PROFESSOR JARED GRUENWALD. It is all to us what will happen next, but i think, Norway and Greece in return for a united Germany pro Allied country is a small price to pay, even if the people in those countries might see otherwise. I'm no expert for this kind of AH, but IRL the US & NATO were concerned that the Soviets might get a foothold in these seas. Russia's always been a land-based power, but still. Well here the Germans traded them for peace, and also helped the Soviets take over Romania, Bulgaria Hungary and Slovakia. |
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Post by Max Sinister on Jul 8, 2023 21:05:13 GMT
I'm no expert for this kind of AH, but IRL the US & NATO were concerned that the Soviets might get a foothold in these seas. Russia's always been a land-based power, but still. Well here the Germans traded them for peace, and also helped the Soviets take over Romania, Bulgaria Hungary and Slovakia. OK, as said - I haven't read the books yet.
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lordroel
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Post by lordroel on Jul 9, 2023 8:41:34 GMT
Well here the Germans traded them for peace, and also helped the Soviets take over Romania, Bulgaria Hungary and Slovakia. OK, as said - I haven't read the books yet. Well that is why this thread is here, to ask and to discuse. |
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Post by simon darkshade on Jul 9, 2023 9:51:11 GMT
As said in 2021, there is so much better out there than the equivalent of the Burger King of AH. There are absolutely scenarios where we could see a Soviet Norway and Greece, even though it would take a particularly incompetent Western Allies to get both. However, this isn’t just one bug in an otherwise well crafted, realistic, well written and well researched work, but one of multiple features that don’t hold up well 20 years later, either in comparison to other professionally published WW2 AH or that written on forums.
I like Niles and Dobson’s works for AD&D and TSR from the 1980s-mid 1990s. Niles can write a very good fantasy battle sequence, portray the sweep of broad events intersecting with individual characters and develop a semi-complex (for 80s fantasy!) plot competently. Both blokes were good game designers. Yet despite these abilities, making the jump to WW2 and AH proved to be too much of a leap for them. It was a huge disappointment to read coming from someone who had appreciated their stuff since childhood/for quarter of a century.
FotR didn’t come across as similar in style to the previous work of either man and, dealing with the real world and well covered history, runs into areas that didn’t come up in other genres, such as logistics and technical limitations. To be honest, I could see echoes of TSR’s 1980s Battlesystem miniature wargame rules coming through in decisions and focus; a lot of fair stuff on tactics, but a great deal of handwavium on strategy. Like Burger King or any fast food hamburger equivalent, the book hits some points through the literary/military historical equivalents of fat, salt and sugar, but isn’t good for you and can’t really be described as good quality.
It certainly hasn’t aged particularly well, but can be viewed in the context of published AH in that period of the early 2000s.
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lordroel
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Post by lordroel on Jul 20, 2023 13:57:38 GMT
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gillan1220
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Post by gillan1220 on Jul 20, 2023 16:22:21 GMT
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lordroel
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Post by lordroel on Jul 20, 2023 16:24:31 GMT
Will check it out, thanks. |
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stevep
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Post by stevep on Jul 20, 2023 23:09:52 GMT
Damn you gillan1220, I had things planned for this evening and ended up reading that TL. Some interesting ideas but also some ideas that sound rather odd. For instance he seems a bit weak on the understanding of the decolonization issue, and the events for the USSR and China post war seem rather wild. Plus I'm doubtful if Nehru would actually ally with a right wing imperialist as in the TL. Ditto that the partition in India would be as peaceful as proposed. Given the hung number of Muslims in India - including the millions who stayed OTL I can't see them all being able to move to Pakistan, or willing to do so so suspect their presence would still be a significant issue. |
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lordroel
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Post by lordroel on Jul 21, 2023 7:59:59 GMT
Damn you gillan1220, I had things planned for this evening and ended up reading that TL. Some interesting ideas but also some ideas that sound rather odd. For instance he seems a bit weak on the understanding of the decolonization issue, and the events for the USSR and China post war seem rather wild. Plus I'm doubtful if Nehru would actually ally with a right wing imperialist as in the TL. Ditto that the partition in India would be as peaceful as proposed. Given the hung number of Muslims in India - including the millions who stayed OTL I can't see them all being able to move to Pakistan, or willing to do so so suspect their presence would still be a significant issue. At least it is not me this time that ruin your weekend stevep. |
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gillan1220
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Post by gillan1220 on Jul 21, 2023 9:48:09 GMT
Damn you gillan1220 , I had things planned for this evening and ended up reading that TL. Some interesting ideas but also some ideas that sound rather odd. For instance he seems a bit weak on the understanding of the decolonization issue, and the events for the USSR and China post war seem rather wild. Plus I'm doubtful if Nehru would actually ally with a right wing imperialist as in the TL. Ditto that the partition in India would be as peaceful as proposed. Given the hung number of Muslims in India - including the millions who stayed OTL I can't see them all being able to move to Pakistan, or willing to do so so suspect their presence would still be a significant issue. China here is ruled by an ROC by Yang Xishan, who announces a split with their former American and British allies. The KMT, despite winning the Chinese Civil War, is still authoritarian just like their OTL counterparts. The ROC is still a middle ground in this alternate Cold War, which has become a three-way battle. The ROC forms the Beijing Pact - - this TL's equivalent of the Non-Aligned Movement - with India to counter both Western and Soviet hegemony in Southeast Asia, the Middle East, Africa, and Latin America. |
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