futurist
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Post by futurist on Aug 26, 2016 23:10:55 GMT
Merci beaucoup, LordRoel!  Well do not thank me, thank Google. But i wonder would Ethiopia in World War I launch stacks against the Ottoman Empire as they are the only Central Powers member they can strike, unless Italy in this universe joins them. The Ottoman Empire doesn't appear to have extended as far south as Sudan in 1914 in our TL, though. |
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stevep
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Post by stevep on Aug 26, 2016 23:33:26 GMT
1) - see my point 4. 3) - Agree its probably unlikely given Wilhelm and Tirpitz but I'm reluctant to rule anything out because of the possible butterflies. With both Italy and Britain concerned about Franco-Russian involvement in Ethiopia its possible that Rome might be the link bringing London and Berlin to some agreement. 5) More important than Eritrea on its own but after the defeat by Ethiopia a threat to the colony would be a sore point. Plus you could also add Nice, Savoy, Corsica and Tunisia if you think about Italy in a CP alliance. 6) Basically thinking that since Italy already has an internationally accepted, by Europe anyway, presence in Eritrea a German visit in supporting that presence is going to be more difficult to undermine by the entente power. 1. OK. 3. OK. However, in such a TL, World War I certainly isn't going to break out as early as the 1910s. After all, that would certainly be suicide for both Russia and France!  5. Exactly how much economic value did Eritrea actually have for Italy, though? Also, were Nice, Savoy, Corsica, and Tunisia as important for Italy as Trentino and the various Adriatic territories were? In addition to this, couldn't one argue that Corsica was already a lost case for Italy by that point in time due to the historical legacy of the (Corsican) Bonaparte family in France? 6. Wasn't Morocco's independence accepted by international powers (in the form of international treaties) as late as the early 20th century, though? If so, wouldn't France's attempts to establish a protectorate in Morocco in 1911 in our TL have had little legal basis to justify them? If so, I would like to point out that France still succeeded in establishing a protectorate over Morocco in our TL in 1912. Plus, wouldn't both France and Russia (and even Ethiopia, for that matter) have been perfectly willing to recognize Italy's rule over Eritrea in this TL? After all, Eritrea seems like very small potatoes to anger Italy over! 3) Agreed 5) Who said economic value had anything to do with a large amount of colonisation during this period?  Unlike the Trentino and the Adriatic territories Nice and Savoy had been Italian in living memory. They were also clearly Italian in population whereas the Adriatic only really had Italian influence during the high period of Venician power. Tunisia had strong Italian as well as French settlers population, in fact IIRC there were more Italians there than French when it became a French colony. Corsica has a link with France via Napoleon but he also had much influence in Italy and Corsica had more cultural and linguistic links with Italy than with France. Plus again, when has having the strongest moral claim to a region been that high on the priority of many powers when they seek to extend their power and prestige? 6) France's claim to a monopoly of influence over Morocco may have been fragile in legal terms but I refer you to what I said above in point 5. France and Russia may be willing but would Ethiopia be that eager to accept Italian control of its traditional coastline? Also the alliance with Ethiopia by the other powers means that its out of reach for Italy in the future, as is any chance of revenge for the defeat at Adwa. |
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stevep
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Post by stevep on Aug 26, 2016 23:37:25 GMT
Well do not thank me, thank Google. But i wonder would Ethiopia in World War I launch stacks against the Ottoman Empire as they are the only Central Powers member they can strike, unless Italy in this universe joins them. The Ottoman Empire doesn't appear to have extended as far south as Sudan in 1914 in our TL, though. It did however rule the Hejaz region including Mecca and Medina, which might be what Lordroel is referring to? Although without a direct coastline on the Red Sea itself an Ethiopian attack might be difficult. Plus as a predominately Christian country, albeit with a significant Muslim minority, it attacking the Muslim holy cities might not be a wise move. |
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futurist
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Post by futurist on Aug 26, 2016 23:51:25 GMT
The Ottoman Empire doesn't appear to have extended as far south as Sudan in 1914 in our TL, though. It did however rule the Hejaz region including Mecca and Medina, which might be what Lordroel is referring to? Although without a direct coastline on the Red Sea itself an Ethiopian attack might be difficult. Plus as a predominately Christian country, albeit with a significant Muslim minority, it attacking the Muslim holy cities might not be a wise move. |
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futurist
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Post by futurist on Aug 26, 2016 23:53:47 GMT
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lordroel
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Post by lordroel on Aug 27, 2016 7:51:24 GMT
It did however rule the Hejaz region including Mecca and Medina, which might be what Lordroel is referring to? Although without a direct coastline on the Red Sea itself an Ethiopian attack might be difficult. Plus as a predominately Christian country, albeit with a significant Muslim minority, it attacking the Muslim holy cities might not be a wise move. No it only got a navy in 1955 when the United Nations decided to federate Eritrea with Ethiopia and thus Ethiopia acquired a coastline and ports on the Red Sea. |
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stevep
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Post by stevep on Aug 27, 2016 13:07:35 GMT
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lordroel
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Post by lordroel on Aug 27, 2016 13:10:08 GMT
Please no pushing for sombody to respond to a tread. |
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