gillan1220
Fleet admiral
I've been depressed recently. Slow replies coming in the next few days.
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Post by gillan1220 on Jan 30, 2021 13:29:24 GMT
Interesting but I'm a bit uncertain about the actions of the S Korean government in recognising the PGDPRK which is basically one man along with some POWs in Russian rebel hands. This very much mean breaking with the government in Pyongyang and is going to make it very hostile. I would strongly suspect another Korean war breaking out under those circumstances, probably with the north backed by China so not sure Seoul would risk such a crisis?
So we have a clearer idea on deaths from Chinese attacks against both the Philippines and Vietnam. The direct bombing deaths sound low considering the size of them but both victims losing 400k-500k from famine is a serious disaster not to mention is going to be viewed as a war crime by much of the world I would expect.
Otherwise looking good and gives a clearer idea of why some of the things that happened did so.
Steve
I guess China would become a pariah here. No way the West would sit and stand-by seeing this occur. |
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Post by kyuzoaoi on Jan 30, 2021 15:34:40 GMT
What's next with China?
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Post by TheRomanSlayer on Jan 30, 2021 19:56:03 GMT
Interesting but I'm a bit uncertain about the actions of the S Korean government in recognising the PGDPRK which is basically one man along with some POWs in Russian rebel hands. This very much mean breaking with the government in Pyongyang and is going to make it very hostile. I would strongly suspect another Korean war breaking out under those circumstances, probably with the north backed by China so not sure Seoul would risk such a crisis?
So we have a clearer idea on deaths from Chinese attacks against both the Philippines and Vietnam. The direct bombing deaths sound low considering the size of them but both victims losing 400k-500k from famine is a serious disaster not to mention is going to be viewed as a war crime by much of the world I would expect.
Otherwise looking good and gives a clearer idea of why some of the things that happened did so.
Steve
I guess China would become a pariah here. No way the West would sit and stand-by seeing this occur. The hostility here could be intentional, as this might actually become one of the main catalyst for a major incident that might lead to a potential conflict breaking out in the Korean conflict. (Think Northern Limit Line the Movie where the North Koreans attack a South Korean corvette first, and its alternate history TL counterpart, where the PoD is that the South Koreans attack first. That TL can be found on AH.com, under the title "Northern Limit Line") Although anyone could really wonder, who would actually be so eager to have another conflict break out in Asia that will certainly involve Chinese troops? I had looked on the casualty rates from the OTL NATO bombing of Yugoslavia and made a slight increase in adjustments, though IOTL there were allegations that depleted uranium were used by NATO bombers against Yugoslav targets. ITTL, the Chinese would be using napalm, and possibly other weapons that may be controversial in nature. The deliberate targeting of agricultural production areas will play a key role in events taking place in the entire Asian continent after 2000, and unlike OTL, the international community here would be more hostile to Chinese attempts at charming them, thanks to influential Filipino and Vietnamese diasporas around the world. However, the international community would also be hostile to Russian charm offensives against them as well. China's next aim is Central Asia, and judging by the references made in previous updates, Central Asia might become pro-Chinese instead of remaining pro-Russian. However, the Russian military intervention in Kazakhstan and Kyrgyzstan in 2000 after the Russian version of Oplan Bojinka was carried out by Al-Qaeda might tilt the two states back into the Russian orbit. (I might also plan on making a TL within a TL on a PoD of Yeltsin slicing himself on his chest to death, replacing him with Nikolay Ryzhkov as his replacement on the political arena and Russia at least keeping Kazakhstan and Kyrgyzstan, but in exchange for that, an even bloodier version of the current Ukrainian conflict would erupt, along with a hostile, pro-Western Belarus) |
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Post by TheRomanSlayer on Jan 31, 2021 7:24:48 GMT
Chapter Thirty-Two: The Second Russian Civil War Part Seven
TAJIKISTAN ERUPTS INTO CIVIL WAR AS SOVIET LOYALIST-ALIGNED GOVERNMENT FACES POLITICAL CHALLENGE FROM TAJIK OPPOSITION BACKED BY SAUDI ARABIA, IRAN, AND TURKEY
Melbourne Sun
May 5, 1992
Dushanbe, TAJIK SSR – Tajikistan became another casualty in the growing civil war breaking out inside the Soviet Union, as the pro-Soviet loyalist government of Izatullo Khayoyev is facing numerous challenges from various opposition groups. The United Tajik Opposition, an umbrella organization of opposition groups, ranging from Tajik liberals, moderates, and nationalists, to Islamists and rival socialists, have campaigned against the Khayoyev government on the platform of declaring Tajikistan’s independence from the Soviet Union. In addition, neighboring Uzbekistan is already mired in the middle of a civil war of its own, with the Islamists forming an alliance with the pro-independence movement inside Uzbekistan, though official reports of Al-Qaeda’s presence inside Uzbekistan have been confirmed, even by Soviet government officials. The presence of Al-Qaeda in Uzbekistan had electrified the Uzbek Islamist movement, as their collaborators are already preparing for the expansion of Al-Qaeda’s operations into neighboring Tajikistan and Turkmenistan.
“Tajikistan is ripe for liberation from the Shurawi who continued to oppress the people there. I believe that now is the time for the next step in the liberation of Tajikistan from the Shurawi while they are mired in a civil war of their own,” says Ahmad Shah Massoud, who addressed his followers from a military camp inside Afghanistan, on the border with Tajikistan. “While we are grateful to the Mujahideen for their assistance in stopping the Shurawis from conquering all of Afghanistan, I believe that in the long run, they may prove to be more of a nuisance to the Afghan people than they are useful.”
Soviet Red Army troops stationed in Tajikistan, particularly the 201st Motor Rifle Division, were deployed to the streets of the capital city, Dushanbe, to prevent the Tajik opposition groups from seizing control of the city. The apparent loyalty of the 201st Motor Rifle Division to the Soviet loyalist government had resulted in the Tajik Opposition’s decision to form a Tajik National Guard to oppose the Soviet loyalists inside Tajikistan. Unlike the other areas of the Soviet Union, none of the Tajik Opposition’s leaders would entertain the idea of a power sharing agreement with the Russian Provisional Government, both because of geographic and political considerations. In addition, the presence of the Soviet loyalist forces inside Central Asia is much stronger than the other regions of the USSR, with the Siberian and Far Eastern regions of the Russian SFSR being the weakest, as their focus of any potential future conflict would be in Europe.
--- Portions from the Sky News AU Interview with Shah Ahmad Massoud
Sky News AU Interview, August 25, 2018
Discussing Massoud’s Role in the Tajik Theater of the Second Russian Civil War (Note that Massoud gives his answers in Tajik, which requires a translator to translate his words into English for the audience)
Interviewer: We are currently discussing your role in the Tajik chapter of the Second Russian Civil War here, Mr. Massoud. What was your main role in it, as a member of the Mujahideen that entered Soviet Central Asia?
Massoud: (translated into English) Initially, we wanted to help our brethren across the border with gaining their independence from the Soviet Union. However, we had difficulty in recruiting potential collaborators due to the strong influence of the Soviet loyalist forces there, and the Soviets also retained the loyalty of many Tajiks. It was only the religiously inclined portion of the populace that wanted to join us, and even then, they faced opposition from within their own families, who benefited from the Soviet presence inside Central Asia.
Interviewer: I see. So, did you had any reservations to the presence of groups like Al-Qaeda inside Tajikistan, which started to recruit local Tajiks to engage in a major conflict against the Soviet loyalists there?
Massoud: Our friend Abdullah Yusuf Azzam was placed in charge of the Al-Qaeda cell in Uzbekistan, while Ayman al-Zawahiri was appointed the leader of the Al-Qaeda cell in Tajikistan. It was al-Zawahiri who warned Azzam about a planned assassination attempt on his life back in 1989, leading to his increased influence among the Al-Qaeda fighters there.
Interviewer: So, in addition to the Al-Qaeda presence in Central Asia, did it have any influence in the Caucasus at all?
Massoud: They did have influence there, as evident by the rise of the Caucasia cell within Al-Qaeda, but they had trouble when they ran into Hezbollah on the border between Russian Dagestan and Azerbaijan. The Azeris there had some help from Hezbollah and Iran, but it was mainly Turkey who was the biggest ally of the Azeris there.
Interviewer: So, in effect, it was the Caucasus area that witnessed the first stage of Al-Qaeda’s war against Russia, during and after the Second Russian Civil War. Was it Al-Qaeda’s attacks on targets within Russia, Ukraine and Belarus that led to the Russian invasion of Kazakhstan and Kyrgyzstan, or was it something else?
Massoud: It was a combination of both factors. You see, after the formal dissolution of the Soviet Union in 1995, the Central Asian republics had established their own socialist regimes there, but by then, the Islamist presence had grown strong enough to challenge their authority. In some cases, it led to the fall of the socialist regimes in Kazakhstan, Uzbekistan, and Kyrgyzstan. However, it was the Troitsk School Hostage scenario that ultimately led to the invasion.
Interviewer: The Troitsk School Hostage scenario, as many viewers could understand, was an incident in the Russian city of Troitsk, where an entire elementary school was captured by Al-Qaeda affiliates that operated out of Kazakhstan. The hostage crisis lasted for five days, until a combined Spetsnaz-Rosgvardiya operation led to the successful rescue of the hostages, but not before the Al-Qaeda hostage takers have killed nine students and two teachers, that the government of Gennady Burbulis had nearly collapsed. After Mykola Azarov’s ascension as President of both the Russian Federation and the Union State of Ukraine and Belarus after their merger, he authorized the Russian invasion of Kazakhstan. The Russians continued their occupation until 2002, when the Russian Army withdrew from Kazakhstan and Kyrgyzstan, but not before being met by grateful Kazakhs and Kyrgyz for their role in driving out Al-Qaeda from the region. (turns to Massoud) As for what happened in Afghanistan, did one of the Al-Qaeda cells there helped re-establish order inside the country?
Massoud: Well, yes, and no. We still had to deal with the hopelessly corrupt government under Mohammad Najibullah until 1992, when the victors of the war against the Soviet Union had started to fight each other. However, because of Al-Qaeda’s expansion of its operations in Uzbekistan and Tajikistan, their bases were subsequently absorbed by the Hezb-e Islami Gulbuddin, under Gulbuddin Hekmatyar. My faction, the Shura-e Nazar, had brokered a pact with other leaders like Abdul Rashid Dostum, who led his own group, though ethnic differences were a bit more open in this area as well. However, it was my pact with Abdul Ali Mazari that led to Al-Qaeda targeting me for assassination missions, which often failed.
Interviewer: Some commentators have said that Al-Qaeda’s overextension into the rest of Central Asia was a factor in why the civil war in Afghanistan had resulted in the victory of Gulbuddin Hekmatyar, mainly because the Al-Qaeda cells in Afghanistan were eventually absorbed. Since then, there was a minor group called the Taliban, which fought for an Islamic theocracy to be established in Afghanistan. However, the civil war in Afghanistan was started by Hekmatyar himself, who did not recognize the short-lived interim government that was established after the fall of Mohammad Najibullah’s government. Moreover, the Taliban did not emerge as a movement until after 1994 when they announced that they were going to liberate all of Afghanistan from the control of corrupt warlords. However, it was revealed that Pakistan had played a role in its creation, a claim that most Pakistani officials have denied. Is there any truth in their denial?
Massoud: I am not sure by what you mean, but if you asked me about Pakistan’s role in the creation of the Taliban, I am sure that they did play a major role, as they did when the Soviet Union invaded Afghanistan. However, you also had to look at the struggle in Afghanistan as basically a proxy war between Iran and Pakistan, which competed for influence in Central Asia after 1995, when the Soviet Union formally disbanded itself. Iran wanted a friendly neutral neighbor that would be able to allow the Iranian clerical regime to focus their attention on supporting the Basra Special Administrative Jurisdiction, which was carved out of the tiny slice of Iraqi territory taken from Saddam Hussein’s regime. Pakistan too, wanted a friendly regime in Kabul that would serve its interest, to secure trading routes.
Interviewer: I see. Let us ask about your role in the emerging Maoist influence in the former Soviet Central Asia. The election of the Revolutionary Brotherhood Party in Uzbekistan in 2007 was marked as the first time that the communists were democratically elected to power since the fall of the Soviet Union, but its origins lay with the unholy alliance between the Neo-Maoists who were former Soviet loyalists that aligned themselves with the Chinese after the fall of the USSR, and the Islamists who were first terrified of the Taliban, and then Al-Qaeda’s growing strength. It took a Russian military intervention to destroy the presence of Al-Qaeda in Kazakhstan and Kyrgyzstan but could not extend their military intervention into the rest of Central Asia, without arousing American opposition. What is your opinion on the whole Islamo-Maoist movement that is going on?
Massoud: You cannot mix the teachings of the Holy Quran and Karl Marx because the lessons there are fundamentally opposed to each other. As I understand it, the sheer incompatibility of such an ideology is exactly why the Revolutionary Brotherhood Party was voted out of power in 2012, and this was done without outside help.
Interviewer: Yet, even in the West, we have influential modern-day politicians who are self-professed ‘socialists’ and ‘communists’ have cited Uzbekistan as a model for the mixture of Islam and Socialism, despite the absolute chaos that engulfed the state. You had the Uzbek som dropping its value to the point where 1 US dollar would equal to over 500,000 Uzbek soms. The hyperinflation of the Uzbek som, along with the failed economic reforms that amounted to the same kind of disaster as the Maoist Great Leap Forward, resulted in Uzbekistan being the third largest recipient of international aid in the world, after Vietnam, and the Philippines. Yet, out of those three nations, two of them were under communist rule, and one was basically a fascist junta.
Massoud: The economic chaos of Uzbekistan proved my point that the teachings of Islam and communism cannot be reconciled. Sure, they have some commonalities, but the fundamental differences between the two have resulted in not only the rise of the reactionary movements within Uzbekistan, but you had Uzbek migrants in the West who were prone to picking fights with Western college students, most of whom were influenced by left-wing ideas that were being pumped into those post-secondary institutions. At one point, there was an American activist of Hispanic origin who traveled to Uzbekistan, to see what an Islamo-Maoist society would look like. Even more so, I was in Uzbekistan as well, holding conferences and speeches about the problems that Central Asia faced during the period of political instability.
Interviewer: So, it seems that you had a chat with a rising star within the newly established Social Progressive Party that broke away from the Democratic Party in the United States. I know we are getting off topic, so we should take a break when we come back.
Massoud: On that, I agree.
--- “Soviet Central Asia remained under the control of Soviet loyalists, mainly because some of the diehards within the old CPSU had relocated to Shymkent, after the defeat of the Red Army in Chernobyl, and the bigger battle for Moscow, in which the National Redemption Army had taken the capital, after five months of fighting. The fight for Moscow as even bloodier than the Battle of Stalingrad, mainly because the Red Army was committed to defending the capital of the entire USSR. However, the NRA was equally determined to destroy the socialist experiment under the banner of nationalism, and as a result, only Central Asia was left within the USSR. We were in a unique situation where the Central Asians now outnumber the ethnic Russians in this new USSR, and it did not help that that only a few months after the USSR voted to disband itself, we saw Russians and other Slavic ethnic groups being expelled by vengeful Central Asians in Operation: Batyr. What was the result of this kind of action? Central Asia had five, separate socialist regimes there, but the influence of the Islamists were too strong that they fell apart. What happened to Kazakhstan and Kyrgyzstan after the Russian Army withdrew from there? They restored relations with Russia, but the issue of Pritobolye and Priirtyshye remained a sore topic between Russia and Kazakhstan. So, in another agreement between Azarov and Kazakhstan’s President Gani Qasymov, Russia would surrender some territory in Orenburg Oblast to Kazakhstan, as payment for Kazakhstan officially ceding the Russian populated regions of Northern Kazakhstan, demarcating the Irtysh and Tobol Rivers as the natural borders between Russia and Kazakhstan, and the regions around Western Kazakhstan up to the Ural River, that was taken by Russia as well, with population exchanges occurring between Russians and Kazakhs. However, Kazakhstan and Kyrgyzstan would eventually become more Russophobic and more pro-Chinese, with Chinese merchants and businessmen being a common sight in the streets of Bishkek and Almaty.” Sergey Mikheev, from the documentary “Russia’s Loss of Central Asia for Retention of Ukraine and Belarus”.
--- KADIJEVIC LED JUNTA TO HOLD REFERENDUM ON THE STATUS OF ALL YUGOSLAV REPUBLICS
Edmonton Journal
March 18, 1991
 General Veljko Kadijevic discusses the planned referendum on the status of Yugoslavia with his representative in their respective constituent republics.Belgrade, YUGOSLAVIA – The emerging Yugoslav junta, led by Veljko Kadijevic, has made a stunning announcement in front of delegates inside Yugoslavia’s national parliament. The proposed referendum will decide on the fate of the entire Socialist Federal Republic of Yugoslavia, with independence as an option for some of the republics. Only a few days after Kadijevic ordered the Yugoslav Army to crack down on the emerging Serbian nationalist movement led by Vuk Draskovic, with its followers fleeing, ironically, to the Soviet Union, where they formed volunteer units to fight for the Russian Provisional Government, the Yugoslav junta announced the date of the referendum on May 9, 1992. While the proposed date of the referendum was met with apprehension by the junta representative for the Socialist Republic of Croatia, Anton Tus, Kadijevic insisted that the date of the referendum will give the junta enough time to hold additional discussions with each of the Yugoslav republics.
“I cannot say for certain that Yugoslavia would remain united after the referendum, but at least this is going in a positive direction,” says Croatia’s pro-independence activist Franjo Tudjman, after learning about the referendum. “Kadijevic’s crackdown on the Serbian nationalist hooligans had ensured that if any of the Yugoslav republics were to secede, they would do so, without any bloodshed involved.”
The Kadijevic-led junta also discussed with Anton Tus on the status of the Serbian minority in areas of the SAO Kninska Krajina, SAO Western Slavonia, and SAO Eastern Slavonia, Baranja and Western Syrmia, which, it is believe, would potentially result in their abolition and the mass resettlement of the Serbian population residing inside the Socialist Republic of Croatia to Serbia, Montenegro, and even in Kosovo as well. However, Kadijevic insisted that the population transfer of Croatian Serbs to Serbia and Montenegro would have to be accomplished before the referendum would take place, as to ensure a smooth transition of power to any possible seceding republic who wishes to leave Yugoslavia. In addition, a similar deal was made with Bosnia’s junta representative, Halil Seferovic, who insisted that Bosnia would be allowed to negotiate some territorial adjustments with Serbia and Montenegro, before allowing the referendum to take place, with the possible relocation of Serbs living inside Bosnia to Serbia itself, in exchange for Bosniaks living in Serbia that would potentially be relocated to Bosnia.
“Marshal Tito did not take into consideration of the minorities that would be affected by the transfer agreements, so now the junta is left to clean up his mess,” Fikret Abdic commented on the possible population exchanges between the Serbs in Bosnia with Bosniaks living in Serbia. “But now, we are returning to the era where minorities are being exchanged by various sovereign states, just like in 1945.”
In addition, the fate of the Kosovar Albanian population of Kosovo and their status would also be decided on the referendum, asking if the Albanian minority would be granted official minority status within Yugoslavia, a move that would gain approval by the Albanian government, as the issue of Albanians living outside the borders of the Albanian republic have been a hot topic of Albanian nationalists.
“Even if the Serbs try to make things better for our brethren in Kosovo, we will not stop until all Albanians, regardless of religious background, are united in a larger, Albanian state. The partition of Kosovo, as much as I do not like to see it happen, might be the only option that would allow our brothers and sister who reside in Kosovo to unite with Albania proper, and the Albanians of Western Macedonia will also come back home to us as well,” comments local activist Xafer Hasa, one of the proponents of the irredentist Greater Albania idea.
--- “The Yugoslav Referendum of 1992 has resulted in over 97% of the inhabitants of the Socialist Republic of Slovenia voting in favor of independence, and over 95% of Croatia’s inhabitants voting in favor of independence as well. However, in Bosnia, the referendum is split, with each of the three main ethnic groups voting between remaining with Yugoslavia, independence, and in the case of the Bosnian Croats, unification with Croatia, as the main choices. Bosnia’s government threatened to boycott the referendum unless the option of Hercegovina’s unification with Croatia was taken out of the ballot. This action would lead to the only conflict in the Balkans, informally called the Hercegovinan War of Independence, where Bosnian Croats would launch a rebellion against the Bosnian government in Sarajevo. The Bosnian Serbs on the other hand, voted in favor of remaining in Yugoslavia, and the Bosniaks voted in favor of independence. Thus, the pro-independence vote in Bosnia was at 60%, while the pro-remain vote was only at 40%. However, in Montenegro, over 78% had voted to remain with Yugoslavia and to retain the union with Serbia, while over 93% of Serbia’s population voted to retain the Yugoslav state, with over 67% voting in favor of recognizing the Albanian minority as the official minority of Yugoslavia, with cultural autonomy and their right of freedom of worship, though some of their economic benefits obtained during the previous communist regimes would come to an end, as a major concession to the Serbian moderate nationalists who distanced themselves from Vuk Draskovic’s movement. In Macedonia, over 85% of its population voted to leave Yugoslavia, which resulted in gaining independence, but Greece’s objection to the independence of Macedonia stemmed from the name itself, as Macedonia was also the home of Alexander the Great, one of Greece’s main historical figure. In the end, both Yugoslavia and Greece negotiated on calling the modern, independent Macedonian nation as the Republic of North Macedonia-Dardania. Unfortunately, the Hercegovinan War of Independence would become the only conflict in the Balkans that would be televised on international television. Croatia would eventually win the conflict with Bosnia over Hercegovina, as well as areas designated as Bosanski Brod, or the border regions of northern Bosnia with Croatia. To this day, only Croatia, Ireland, and San Marino would recognize the unification of Hercegovina with Croatia, while the international community would recognize Bosnian sovereignty over Hercegovina, although Croats would protest at the Bosnian government’s handover of Bijeljina to Yugoslavia as justification that Croatia needed to bring in Bosnian territories with Croatian populations in it. In addition, both Bosnia and Croatia would not form diplomatic relations with each other, and their borders would be closed to each other.” From “The Dissolution of Yugoslavia” from PBS Documentaries, published February 21, 2010.
--- LOREN LEGARDA TO VISIT BALKAN REGION IN ADDITION TO THE VATICAN IN HER FIRST TRIP AS HEAD OF STATE, MARKS THE FIRST FOREIGN TRIP OF PHILIPPINE LEADER SINCE THE RESIGNATION OF ARTEMIO TADIAR
Philippine Daily Inquirer
January 6, 2017
 President Loren Legarda addresses the media on her foreign trip to the Vatican, as a part of her diplomatic overture to the international community, after years of political semi-isolation of the Tadiar years in which their only friends were other authoritarian regimes in Mexico, Chile, and Argentina, plus the semi-authoritarian government in Japan, and most controversially, Australia.Kabankalan, FEDERAL CAPITAL REGION – President Loren Legarda announced her travel itinerary for her first foreign visit as head of state for the first time since Artemio Tadiar stepped down from his position as leader of the recently-disbanded Council for National Salvation. She named the Vatican as the main destination for her trip, since one of her campaign goals was to restore diplomatic ties with the Holy See, through a meeting with Pope Benedict XVI. In addition to her trip to the Vatican, she will also pay a visit to the Balkans, starting with Slovenia, Croatia, Bosnia, Yugoslavia and ending her visit in Bulgaria, where a growing Filipino community resides. Vice President Jejomar Binay also announces that the Philippines will also restore diplomatic ties with the West, after a decade of diplomatic isolation in which the former Tadiar regime only kept its diplomatic ties open with Chile, Mexico, Argentina, Australia, and Japan.
“It is about time for the Philippines to rediscover its diplomatic ties that have been lost, mainly due to Artemio Tadiar,” Vice President Binay commented when asked about the restoration of diplomatic ties that the Philippines will do. “In addition, we will also pay a visit to the United States, to President Tim Kaine, in the future.”
Political commentators have expected the newly elected President would also sign a formal peace treaty with the People’s Republic of China, which had been technically at war with the Philippines since the 1993-95 West Philippine Sea conflict that resulted in China’s unilateral seizure of the entire Spratly Islands. However, the largest opposition in the newly reconstituted Philippine House of Representatives and the Philippine Senate, the National Unity Alliance, of which Nicanor Faeldon’s Fatherland Freedom Party is the main head, had objected to the formal end to the war with China, seeing it as a preferable option to a peace treaty that would certainly result in the permanent loss of Scarborough Shoal to China. In response, President Legarda insisted on a unilateral withdrawal of Chinese troops from Scarborough Shoal and other parts of the Spratly Islands as a prerequisite for an eventual peace treaty with China. Since 1995, both the Philippines and China were still technically at war with each other, even though the Chinese conflict started off with the attack on Vietnam because of its naval skirmish in the Johnson South Reef area. The 2002-2004 Continuation War in Korea also saw Philippine and Chinese troops engage in battle for the first time since 1995, resulting in the most brutal and savage battle of the 21st century, with both Filipino and Chinese troops slaughtering each other during the push towards Kumchon, in the former North Korea, with Chinese volunteers deploying on the former North Korean side, while Philippine volunteers were deployed on the erstwhile South Korean side, alongside American, Australian, Mexican, and Canadian troops. In particular, the Battle of Kumchon was celebrated in Philippine nationalist circles as the second Filipino victory over the Chinese, after the Battle of Yultong was celebrated as its first victory. However, President Legarda still must deal with the various junior and senior military officers who were trained by Chilean graduates of the infamous School of the Americas, and their influence in the Philippine government is still strong.
In addition, President Legarda’s visit to the Balkans would focus the issue on the Filipino diaspora that resided in Croatia and Yugoslavia after the 1995 Chinese military aggression on the Philippines and Vietnam, with its main goal of either repatriation back to the Philippines, or immigration to Western Europe, North America, or Australia. Surprisingly, Croatia is the most influential of the Balkan nations in the Philippines, with the Philippine national football team’s hiring of former Tier-2 Croatian football coach Miroslav Bojko as the Philippines’ first foreign head coach in years.
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Post by kyuzoaoi on Jan 31, 2021 17:25:37 GMT
Good grief, Second Korean War is a slaughterfest.
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gillan1220
Fleet admiral
I've been depressed recently. Slow replies coming in the next few days.
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Likes: 11,338
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Post by gillan1220 on Jan 31, 2021 17:42:06 GMT
Yay, Massoud lives!
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Post by TheRomanSlayer on Jan 31, 2021 17:45:51 GMT
Hopefully the Taliban could be killed off early before they rise to power, but knowing that there are far too many corrupt warlords hanging around, they might be the only one to clean it up, and set up an even bigger brutal regime.
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gillan1220
Fleet admiral
I've been depressed recently. Slow replies coming in the next few days.
Posts: 12,622
Likes: 11,338
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Post by gillan1220 on Jan 31, 2021 17:52:36 GMT
Hopefully the Taliban could be killed off early before they rise to power, but knowing that there are far too many corrupt warlords hanging around, they might be the only one to clean it up, and set up an even bigger brutal regime. Massoud probably forms the equivalent of the Northern Alliance here. Probably it would be named United Front for Afghanistan.  |
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Post by TheRomanSlayer on Jan 31, 2021 18:11:40 GMT
That might be the most likely action that Massoud would take. His alliance with the Hazaras would certainly come in handy against the Taliban here.
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gillan1220
Fleet admiral
I've been depressed recently. Slow replies coming in the next few days.
Posts: 12,622
Likes: 11,338
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Post by gillan1220 on Jan 31, 2021 18:41:49 GMT
That might be the most likely action that Massoud would take. His alliance with the Hazaras would certainly come in handy against the Taliban here. Im guessing Abdul Rashid Dostum would make an appearance on this timeline as well. In OTL, he was one of the heads of the Northern Alliance and he fought alongside U.S. Special Forces in October 2001 during the Battle of Mazar-i-Sharif as seen in 12 Strong. |
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Post by TheRomanSlayer on Jan 31, 2021 18:46:13 GMT
Dostum will definitely make an appearance here as well. Also, without Bin Laden, you might have a different scenario for the Taliban where an equivalent to them might arise elsewhere.
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Post by TheRomanSlayer on Feb 2, 2021 5:44:48 GMT
Chapter Thirty-Three: The Second Russian Civil War Part Eight
RUSSIAN REBEL GENERAL KILLED BY SOVIET AIRSTRIKE WHILE STAYING INSIDE A HOSPITAL DUE TO HEALTH ISSUES
Edmonton Journal
June 3, 1992
Kaliningrad, RUSSIAN SFSR – One of the most prominent Russian rebel generals, former Northern Group of Forces commander Viktor Dubynin, was killed by a Soviet airstrike in the city of Kaliningrad. Days before his death, the former Northern Group of Forces commander was admitted into the hospital due to health concerns, when it was revealed that Dubynin, was in fact, dying from cancer. The death of Dubynin had resulted in the rise of Sergei Ivanov as Dubynin’s successor as commander of the Northern Group of Forces, although the formal title was replaced with ‘Commander of the Russian Expeditionary Forces – Western Russia’, though aligned formally with the National Redemption Army. Although no one knows who gave the order to bomb Kaliningrad where Dubynin was stationed, it was quickly assumed that Gennady Troshev was the one who gave the order, though said general denied the claims that he gave the order.
In addition, the Soviet forces stationed in northern Belarus have faced numerous attacks by both regular NRA troops and Belarus’s equivalent of Rosgvardiya, Belgvardiya, to dislodge them from the city of Polotsk. Soviet commander of the Belarus-Russia garrison forces, Valentin Varennikov, had criticized the lack of foresight from other Soviet commander in terms of planning and launching their military operations, resulting in him becoming the de facto planner of said military operations. However, his dedication to the Soviet Union is quite rare for a Soviet loyalist, while other Soviet loyalist officers were rumored to only serve in the loyalist armies as an opportunity for an advancement in their military and political careers.
“The honor of the Soviet officer has been besmirched by the brutal behavior displayed by certain officers who serve the Union. While it was necessary to launch a bombing campaign against rebel forces, undefended civilian targets are not legitimate targets in a war,” Varennikov explains in front of junior officers while giving a speech inside the Frunze Military Academy. “These actions only serve to give the rebels enough material to launch their insidious propaganda campaign in order to turn the Soviet people against their government.”
Other Soviet loyalist forces were also mired in a brutal war against the Baltic separatists, which often resorted to using their paramilitary forces to eject the Red Army out of their respective republics. For instance, a large force of 26,000 Red Army soldiers were sent on orders of Gennady Troshev to besiege the Lithuanian capital of Vilnius, with only 15,000 Lithuanian militiamen and ex-Red Army deserters drafted to defend the capital. In contrast, the Soviet mission to pacify Estonia and Latvia have also ran into trouble, with both the Estonian and Latvian paramilitaries launching guerrilla attacks on Red Army soldiers, and anti-communist Russian paramilitaries unaffiliated with either the Justice Brigades or the National Redemption Army that have also carried out attacks on the Red Army.
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NATIONAL REDEMPTION ARMY LAUNCHES OFFENSIVE INTO VOLGOGRAD, WHILE SOVIET LOYALIST FORCES BARELY SUCCEED IN REPELLING REBEL ATTACK IN SAMARA
Sydney Herald
July 19, 1992
Volgograd, RUSSIAN SFSR – Approximately over 19,000 National Redemption Army soldiers under the command of Valentin Korabelnikov have launched an attack on the Soviet loyalist stronghold of Volgograd, known as the famous site of the Battle of Stalingrad. Defending the city of Volgograd were both Soviet loyalist forces and pro-Soviet paramilitaries, both under the command of General Yuri Baluyevsky. Though both sides are expecting a log, drawn out conflict in the city, they are confident enough of their victory, if they will not have to fight in the winter, like their parents and grandparents have done during the German invasion of the Soviet Union. Unlike the Battle of Stalingrad however, the battle for Volgograd has a higher stake in terms of its strategic value, as a rebel conquest of Volgograd would allow the Russian Provisional Government to cut off supply routes between Moscow and the Caucasus, at the same time as supplying other anti-Soviet forces with much needed materiel. Conversely, a loyalist retention of Volgograd would also give a much-needed morale boost to the Red Army and keep the supplies flowing to other loyalist forces in the Caucasus region.
On the other hand, the Soviet loyalist forces have barely managed to repel a National Redemption Army assault on the city of Samara, in the northern Volga River region, with just 9,320 troops under loyalist command, against 10,240 rebel soldiers. Though Samara was lightly defended, the rebel forces sent to assault the city were poorly armed and poorly led as well. However, the Soviet loyalist forces suffered significant casualties in the defense of Samara, with over 38% of its forces being killed or injured, while over 41% of the rebel forces sent to capture Samara were killed. Unfortunately, while the rebel forces have lost in Samara, the Soviet loyalist forces there are unable to replenish their losses, as the Tatar ASSR is under a rebel-inspired uprising. Likewise, the Bashkir ASSR has also seen a rebel uprising as well, with both the delegates from those autonomous republics within the Russian SFSR seeking to acquire the same kind of power sharing agreement with the Russian Provisional Government as the Buryat and Yakut ASSR have obtained.
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“Much of Western and Central Siberia have already fallen under the control of the Russian Provisional Government before Leonid Khabarov’s offensive into areas of Siberia that are still under loyalist control have been launched. Starting by September of 1992, Khabarov’s forces increased their troop count from 35,000 to over 67,000, with three quarters of them consisting entirely of Rosgvardiya and Justice Brigade paramilitary personnel. Although they were insufficiently trained, with training time only taking around four months, they made up for their lack of experience by being mixed in with battle hardened troops of the regular National Redemption Army. Moreover, their motivation to fight came from their hardships in Siberian gulags, making them the perfect kind of soldier to be deployed against both the regular Red Army forces and the Soviet Internal Troops as well. In addition, Alexander Lebed’s insistence on the massive reformation of the National Redemption Army’s combat doctrine was implemented with the experiences of the 106th Guards Airborne Division that have been gained in Afghanistan in mind. The result was that the National Redemption Army became more professional in terms of their conduct than the old-fashioned mindset still stuck within the Soviet Army. In addition, the combined arms offensive favored by the National Redemption Army was usually conducted with the air force launching bombing raids into enemy positions, followed by ground forces launching an attack, as evident by the 106th Guards Airborne Division’s advance into what remains of the enemy positions. While heavy armor and artillery attacks would also follow, Lebed’s preference for heavy armor to flank around the target instead of advancing straight into a line had minimized the casualties that the armored regiments normally suffered. However, this was replaced with infantry and motor rifle regiments going straight into the target, where they would certainly be easy targets for snipers and anti-tank troops. The result of this was that the National Redemption Army would suffer light casualties while the Soviet defenders of the city they are holding would suffer a larger casualty rate. However, the Soviet reliance on heavy firepower has nullify their weakness, in that they have more ammunition than their rebel counterparts. Ultimately, it will depend on the overall leadership qualities of the officers on both sides and how they manage to lead their armies to victory in this brutal civil war.” From “The Second Russian Civil War and the Rise of Modern Russia” from TASS.
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ESTONIAN AND LATVIAN REFUGEES ARRIVE IN FINLAND, AMIDST CIVIL WAR INSIDE SOVIET UNION
Helsinki Times
May 2, 1992
Helsinki, FINLAND – Amidst the worsening conflict inside the Soviet Union, almost 3,400 Estonian and 1,930 Latvian refugees have fled from their homes and made their way across the cold Baltic Sea into the Finnish capital of Helsinki, through the contested Estonian port of Tallinn. The Finnish government under the leadership of Esko Aho, have announced that Finland’s borders would be open to any refugee fleeing from the civil war erupting inside the Soviet Union, though this move was also controversial, as Russian refugees are theoretically qualified to enter Finland as well. However, most of the Russian population of Estonia and Latvia have already relocated to Russia itself, with Leningrad becoming the unlikely destination for the Russian refugees fleeing from the breakaway Estonian and Latvian Republics that have declared their sovereignty inside the Soviet Union. However, pro-independence leaders within the three Baltic Republics have announced a joint referendum on whether they would secede from the Soviet Union.
“Despite the civil war taking place, I honestly think that declaring our independence from the Soviet Union would be the best option for all of us,” comments Estonian independence activist Edgar Savisaar when asked about the referendum. “At this point, we will have to set a date on when we will hold the referendum, upon an agreement with our colleagues in the Latvian and Lithuanian independence movements.”
It is expected that Finland would become the major supporter of the Baltic independence referendum, with even Sweden throwing its support behind the initiative. However, as the Soviet government itself is battling the Russian rebels under Alexander Lebed’s leadership, they are unable to be reached for a comment on the Baltic situation. At the same time, Estonian and Latvian paramilitaries are busy battling both the Soviet loyalist forces there and the Russian rebels that sought to keep their occupied portions of Estonia and Latvia as part of the Russian SFSR. In addition, Norwegian border guards are constantly at an alert for possible Soviet loyalist spies entering Norway, or Russian rebel forces seeking to enter Norway to defect in case they lost the civil war. Within Finland however, the Finnish public has launched a demonstration in favor of Baltic independence from the Soviet Union, causing the Soviet loyalist government to expel the Finnish ambassador to the USSR. However, in a surprising twist, the Finnish ambassador went to Krasnoyarsk to show his credentials to the Russian Provisional Government, despite the Finnish government’s non-recognition of the Russian Provisional Government.
“The time has come for Finland to ditch its neutralist policy regarding the Soviet Union, and to recognize the Russian rebels as the sole, legitimate government that represents all of Russia. At the same time, Finland needs to recognize the necessity of supporting the independence of Estonia, Latvia, and Lithuania, as the international community has not recognized the Soviet annexation of those three republics, even after the Second World War has ended,” Heikki Talvitie said during an impromptu diplomatic summit in Krasnoyarsk, where the temporary seat of the Russian Provisional Government resides. “The end of the Soviet Union is near, and the international community needs to support the Russian freedom fighters in ending the Soviet tyranny, once and for all.”
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EUROPEAN ECONOMIC COMMUNITY HOLDS MEETING ON POSSIBLE REVISION TO MAASTRICHT TREATY, POTENTIAL MERGER WITH EUROPEAN FREE TRADE ASSOCIATION
Die Welt
May 19, 1992
Brussels, BELGIUM – The European Economic Community has summoned most of its delegates from active member states on discussions regarding the possible revision of the failed Maastricht Treaty that would have formally established a European Union, in the aftermath of France and Britain’s rejection of said treaty. Jacques Delor, the President of the European Commission, had expressed frustrations over France’s anger and resentment towards the recent German reunification and its insistence on pushing forward the proposed Ducat that will serve as the EEC’s official currency, and has criticized President Francois Mitterrand’s behavior regarding the recent rejection of the treaty. In addition, German Chancellor Helmuth Kohl’s reaction to the French rejection of Germany’s reunification was understandable, but the German public had been outraged by the French response to it. Moreover, the French public’s fear of a German economic domination of Europe is being raised, considering the recent history from when the last time a unified German state had exercised such political and economic clout.
“Both Monsieurs Mitterrand and Kohl have to stop behaving like teenage boys in a senior high school and start behaving like real politicians. The future of Europe is at stake here, and the last thing we need is a nation with an egotistical leader who only cares about his or her own country’s prestige at the expense of others,” Delor commented after hearing complaints from the Belgian and Danish delegates on the behavior expressed by both Mitterrand and Kohl. “The division of Europe has been exploited by both the United States and the crumbling Soviet Union, and rest assured, only a united Europe could be able to compete in the international arena. Yes, we must consider the sovereign interests of our member states, but at the same time, those sovereign interests must complement each other, not compete with each other.”
The planned revision of the Maastricht Treaty would have included the possible merger with the European Free Trade Association, an expanded set of rules governing economic commerce and trade with non-EEC member states, the strict criteria that future members must meet before formally applying for EEC membership, and most importantly, the decision on the proposed currency. Jürgen Möllemann, who replaced Hans-Dietrich Genscher as Vice Chancellor of Germany, came up with the number of ideas regarding the strict criteria for potential applicants, including judicial and financial reforms that would allow its economy to be integrated with the economies of active and future member states. Dutch Prime Minister Ruud Lubbers proposed the European Development Bank as a financial institution where they would oversee giving loans to active member states for financial and commercial development, while Pierre Beregovoy had once again proposed the Ducat as the EEC’s official currency. However, it was Italian Prime Minister Ciriaco de Mita who advocated for semi-limited control of borders between member states, that convinced most Euroskeptics to go onboard with the treaty. The revised treaty would be subjected to an EEC-wide referendum (only active member states would be allowed to participate), with an additional question of whether the merger between the EEC and EFTA would take place.
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“The course of European integration must continue, but it cannot go at a speed that Europe’s population would not be comfortable with. We are at a crossroads, between reaching out for past glories and future ambitions. We know where we should go, for a divided Europe would only be a tool in the arms of larger powers like the United States, China, and Russia. Our past glories were built on the bones of innocent indigenous peoples who were killed by our ancestors, to build the empire that we craved for. It was not just the British Empire that was responsible for the brutal massacres and exploitations of indigenous peoples around the world: our neighbors were also doing the same thing we were doing. Now, we must come to terms with what we have done in our past, and to use that experience to move forward, to the future of Europe without any emotional baggage that may damage us in the long run. That is why I condemn any calls by any politician from any European state to leave from this organization, because secession from this wider European community would only encourage nationalist sentiment and future troubles ahead.” Member for European Parliament Lynne Featherstone, addressing the European Parliament on rising populism within the European Continental Association, the successor to the EEC.
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EUROPEAN CONTINENTAL ASSOCIATION, EAST SLAVIC FEDERATION TO SIGN MAJOR BLOCKBUSTER FREE TRADE DEAL IN ITS FIRST MAJOR NEGOTIATION SINCE ITS FORMATION
Moscow Times
June 6, 2007
Warsaw, POLAND – The Union Minister for Foreign Affairs, Lene Espersen, had met with her East Slavic Federation counterpart, Foreign Minister Natalia Zarudna, today in Warsaw, Poland, for the upcoming ECA-ESF summit where it is expected that both parties would sign a major free trade agreement. The terms of the free trade deal would involve several free movements of goods between the two camps, as well as establishing a set of rules governing financial transactions for goods traveling between the ECA and Russia. In addition, while the free trade deal would be signed, talks of a potential signing of an Association Agreement has been shot down by the ECA, which feared a potential Russian, rather than German, economic domination of political Europe. Instead, additional talks of common security between the ECA and the ESF were to dominate the rest of the ECA-ESF summit taking place in Warsaw.
“The ECA, while it can pose as a friendly competitor with either China, the ESF, or the United States, it could also pose as a friend and ally to any other party involved. Our partnership with the East Slavic Federation will ensure that the prosperity of the ECA would be protected by the enhanced security agreement made between the ECA and Russia as well,” comments Espersen after being asked about the terms of the possible security agreement with the ESF. “While the current National Atlantic Treaty Organization is still active, we cannot, in our official capacity, negotiate a separate security agreement with the ESF. However, we can also approach NATO with an offer for closer partnerships with the ESF as well.”
The summit is highly controversial, since the ECA leadership is keenly aware of the recent ESF’s military intervention in Kazakhstan and Kyrgyzstan, after a series of Islamist-inspired attacks on targets throughout Russia and Georgia (Ukraine and Belarus suffered attacks as well, but by then, they were counted as fully fledged autonomous republics within Russia, but with a special status that none of Russia’s other autonomous republics have achieved) had resulted in the intervention. US Secretary of State Newt Gingrich had condemned the ECA for making a deal with the ESF, at a time when its military adventure in Central Asia had threatened to re-ignite another conflict within Central Asia. Likewise, Chinese Foreign Minister Tang Jiaxuan had expressed his concerns about the ECA-ESF deal.
“China has a large stake in preventing the deal between the European Continental Association and the East Slavic Federation from taking place, as it can be detrimental to our current efforts at stabilizing most of Central Asia, after the events from the civil war that took place in the former Soviet Union,” comments Foreign Minister Tang. “Moreover, a formal partnership between the ECA and the ESF has a potential to transform it into an attempt at encircling China with hostile regimes that detest us in the first place. Already, you have Mongolia’s government that re-aligned itself with the ESF after the civil war, and ESF meddling in the Korean peninsula has another potential to cause trouble for us as well, and this is on top of revelations that the Tadiar dictatorship in the Philippines had armed the Japanese terrorist group Aum Shinrikyo and playing a role in the infamous Oriental Pearl Tower attack that saw over 3,214 of our citizens killed by these terrorists.”
To appease Chinese concerns, both the ECA and the ESF would collaborate with Chinese intelligence in tracking down and eliminating suspected members of Aum Shinrikyo that have taken part in the infamous attack on the Oriental Pearl Tower attack and has proposed to put current leader of the Philippine Council for National Sovereignty Artemio Tadiar, and much of the senior leadership of the Philippine junta, on trial for charges of terrorism.
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Excerpts from the 60 Minute Interview with an Anonymous Ex-CIA Agent with Tara Brown
60 Minutes (Australia)
July 4, 2018
Discussing the Rise of the CIA “Corsairs”
BROWN: The recent revelation by a former CIA whistleblower whose name we have concealed for her own safety, has revealed that in addition to the notorious ‘Cowboy’ faction that conducted controversial missions on its behalf, the whistleblower has also revealed a second faction within the CIA, dubbed as the ‘Corsairs’. The Corsairs, as many of you will not know, consisted of ex-CIA and ex-NSA agents who collaborated with each other on smuggling missions, and their first mission was not in the Philippines, but rather, the former Soviet Union. Can you tell us about what the Corsairs really were?
ANONYMOUS EX-CIA AGENT: So, in the field missions that we undertook as members of the Corsairs, we took over what was basically the old job of Corporate Air Services, which was to smuggle military hardware to various anti-socialist factions. This was after the CIA had bought out Corporate Air Services and rebranded it as CAS Express in 1990, just a few days before the civil war in the former Soviet Union broke out.
BROWN: Did your group smuggle any goods into the former Soviet Union? I doubt that the Russian rebels needed any outside help from foreign nations.
ANONYMOUS EX-CIA AGENT: We only smuggled in military spies that would be sent by the Pentagon for scouting missions in the Russian Far East. We were to locate the various labor camps and to relay the location to the Russian rebels, which led to the mass liberation of the gulags and the recruitment of former gulag inmates into what was then the National Redemption Army. In addition, we also smuggled foodstuffs into places like the Sakhalin town of Ribnoye, where stuff like wheat, canned goods, and chocolate were smuggled inside.
BROWN: So, it was initially a humanitarian mission then?
ANONYMOUS EX-CIA AGENT: Yes, but as the civil war expanded, we also set up a waystation in the Japanese island of Hokkaido, close to the Kurile Islands. We were to help any Russian refugee that wanted to flee from the fighting there, but as the rebels had consolidated their control over eastern Russia, our mission suddenly switched, and we were no longer needed.
BROWN: What happened after your initial mission?
ANONYMOUS EX-CIA AGENT: We turned to smuggling weapons to the Tadiar regime, and we had to do it in a way that would circumvent the arms embargo. The other Corsairs had established covert connections with Indonesian and Thai intelligence agents on possible actions in SE Asia, since at that time China was gearing up to seize the entire Spratly Islands. For example, if we needed to smuggle components for anti-air defenses, we would disguise it as a shipment of electrical equipment. Keep in mind that we also had to ship in legitimate equipment to make it look like we were not violating the arms embargo.
BROWN: Did your activities helped the Tadiar regime in such a way?
ANONYMOUS EX-CIA AGENT: Yes, and no. We did not anticipate that the Chinese PLAAF would send their heavy bombers to flatten both Vietnam and the Philippines. Their reckless attack had scorched most of the agricultural farmland, to the point where we saw most cities in the Philippines suffering from a food shortage. Surprisingly, no one was willing to revolt against Tadiar since he was also giving commands to make the Chinese aerial campaign costly. In fact, he nearly died by a Chinese airstrike, but luckily it was shot down.
BROWN: Most of the American public had been horrified when they saw the images of bombed out cities in the Philippines that they were calling for former President Jesse Jackson to be impeached.
ANONYMOUS EX-CIA AGENT: Yeah, and the fact that the Democrats had controlled the Senate did help with stopping the impeachment process. However, it was also a Democrat, who also filed a motion to impeach President Jackson.
BROWN: You are of course, speaking of James Traficant, right?
ANONYMOUS EX-CIA AGENT: The very same. Representative Traficant filed a motion to impeach President Jackson, and that made him unpopular with the other Democrats and some Republicans. He saw President Jackson’s inaction as selling out the Philippines to China, but President Jackson saw it differently.
BROWN: How?
ANONYMOUS EX-CIA AGENT: President Jackson had a long-term plan of eventually deposing the Tadiar regime, but he had to do it in a way that would make it look like a legitimate call for regime change, instead of the ham-fisted methods that the Dole administration did.
BROWN: Some say that President Jackson’s long-term plan for weakening the Tadiar regime had costed him the support of the Filipino Americans who voted for him in the first place.
ANONYMOUS EX-CIA AGENT: Yes, and there was a documentary called ‘How Filipino Americans Fell in Love with the Republican Party’, which was technically a propaganda piece. However, going back to my mission in the Philippines. Our cover became official when we were approached by the Tadiar regime to bring in humanitarian goods to help feed the population, despite the economic sanctions. Officially, it was Japan and Indonesia that was flouting the sanctions. Unofficially, we manipulated the Japanese and Indonesian governments into helping us. Even President Prabowo Subianto took the lead in smuggling food into the Philippines.
BROWN: Most of the senior Democrats defended former President Jackson’s long-term plan as a way of bringing democracy back to the Philippines, but some say that it was a heavy price that the former President paid in political support.
ANONYMOUS EX-CIA AGENT: True, and this is also why Filipino Americans played a role in the rise of Carly Fiorina as Republican Senator for California, and most of them had voted for President Kemp for two terms, and then continued to vote for Republican candidates, even after Kemp’s term had expired, despite the growing decline in the popularity of the Republicans.
BROWN: Going back to the Corsairs. When did the world eventually find out about your group?
ANONYMOUS EX-CIA AGENT: When Jack Kemp’s Democrat successor Carol Moseley Braun had been elected as President in 2004. She had Oliver North arrested and indicted on 32 felony counts, the most that an American agent would have. She also outed him as the leader of the Corsairs and had tied him with the infamous Iran-Contra scandal that also tied in with Tadiargate. As a result, the CIA was thoroughly purged of both the Cowboys and Corsairs, but not before we played another role that would ensure that we paid her back.
BROWN: You are of course, confessing to the assassination of former President Braun, right?
ANONYMOUS EX-CIA AGENT: Unfortunately, yes. One of our junior Corsairs had pricked the former president with a poisoned needle while hosting a formal dinner in Washington, a few months before the 2008 US Presidential election that became convoluted because of her premature death. One of the junior agents who killed her said these last words: ‘Oliver North Sends His Regards’.
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stevep
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Post by stevep on Feb 2, 2021 14:11:54 GMT
Well a hell of a lot here. A few points: a) The NLA don't need to control Volograd to block the Volga, which would cause serious problems for the loyalists as said. All they need to do is hold the east bank. Since Volgograd was in WWII virtually all on the west bank and probably mostly is today that would mean crossing the Volga, a huge obstacle, at least unless their able to flank the city to either north or south or better still both.
b) I'm not sure that Finland, which is in a very exposed position, would take the risk of challenging the loyalists so early, especially when they still hold most of the USSR west of the Urals, which is where the bulk of the population is. Although this might depend on how much rebels and independence movements hold in the Ukraine.
c) Afraid that is the sort of dribble that the centralists would use to try and argue for a centralist state.  I'm not saying that bad things didn't happen in the European colonial period but a lot of bad things happened elsewhere as well and most of the wealth of the early industrial age was built on the backs of Europeans not non-Europeans. Similarly the primary reason for most of the big wars in the last few centuries in Europe were less squabbles between independent nations that one power seeking to impose its will on everybody else, which is exactly what the ECA is trying to do here, although hopefully not militarily.
d) I could see the ECA and Russia seeking better trade relations but it would be Russia fearing economic domination not the other way around. Europe west of Russia - even with Ukraine and Belarus included in the latter - has a lot more population, wealth and economic resources that 'Russia'. Even without the terrible devastation that the civil war would have caused.
e) So as well as running illegal operations under multiple Presidents the CIA engaged in the murder of a sitting president because she exposed their activities. I would expect a huge demand for the entire organisation to be purged, if not shut down totally given several decades of deliberate actions in definence of Congress, let alone this.
f) There's a small typo at:
Assuming that 2nd Traficant should be Jackson?
A hell of a ride your putting together.
Steve
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Post by TheRomanSlayer on Feb 3, 2021 4:32:26 GMT
a) The NLA don't need to control Volograd to block the Volga, which would cause serious problems for the loyalists as said. All they need to do is hold the east bank. Since Volgograd was in WWII virtually all on the west bank and probably mostly is today that would mean crossing the Volga, a huge obstacle, at least unless their able to flank the city to either north or south or better still both. That is indeed true, but unlike the OTL Battle of Stalingrad, TTL's Battle of Volgograd would be different in one, key area: military technology. Both the Soviet loyalists and the rebels might employ attack helicopters, and transport helicopters in their battle, while you could see a much bigger role of amphibious vehicles. However, it might depend on how deep the Volga is, so I don't know if an amphibious vehicle could survive the deep Volga River. Yes, the rebels could hold the east bank, but a flanking maneuver might be necessary in this case. The Mamayev Kurgan was an important height that was contested between the Germans and Soviets during the battle of Stalingrad, so control of this height would be really important for both the loyalists and rebels. b) I'm not sure that Finland, which is in a very exposed position, would take the risk of challenging the loyalists so early, especially when they still hold most of the USSR west of the Urals, which is where the bulk of the population is. Although this might depend on how much rebels and independence movements hold in the Ukraine. At this point, Ukraine is technically a rebel nation within the USSR, and one where communist authority has virtually collapsed as a result of the bombing of Lviv. Belarus might be close, though the three Baltic States are caught between pro-independence forces, Soviet loyalists and pro-Lebed rebels. c) Afraid that is the sort of dribble that the centralists would use to try and argue for a centralist state.  " class="smile"] I'm not saying that bad things didn't happen in the European colonial period but a lot of bad things happened elsewhere as well and most of the wealth of the early industrial age was built on the backs of Europeans not non-Europeans. Similarly the primary reason for most of the big wars in the last few centuries in Europe were less squabbles between independent nations that one power seeking to impose its will on everybody else, which is exactly what the ECA is trying to do here, although hopefully not militarily. I'm sorry if this sounded like one of those Europhile MEPs coming from Britain, but I wanted to make it sound like Featherstone was moderating her tone, and not come off as really radical in this case. d) I could see the ECA and Russia seeking better trade relations but it would be Russia fearing economic domination not the other way around. Europe west of Russia - even with Ukraine and Belarus included in the latter - has a lot more population, wealth and economic resources that 'Russia'. Even without the terrible devastation that the civil war would have caused. That is indeed true, but in this case both sides would not want to lose their economic independence to the other. e) So as well as running illegal operations under multiple Presidents the CIA engaged in the murder of a sitting president because she exposed their activities. I would expect a huge demand for the entire organisation to be purged, if not shut down totally given several decades of deliberate actions in definence of Congress, let alone this. Well, there are certain bizarre theories regarding the JFK assassination attempt, and the actual death of TTL's President Braun was actually based on the assassination of Kim Jong-nam in Malaysia. However, you can easily guess what I am referencing with the last quote about Oliver North. And good catch with the typo. I might have to do another OMAKE, this time covering Africa since they have not been debuted yet. I might have a few ideas as to what will happen with West, Central and East Africa, as well as the incoming moneyshot that is post-Apartheid South Africa. |
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stevep
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Post by stevep on Feb 3, 2021 12:40:09 GMT
With the Featherstone quote its just that people like that get my goat as they will do anything to protect their sacred cow [in this case what's now the ECA] and throw any amount of crap at everybody else to do it. Unfortunately there are far too many people like that fouling up things in Europe and the increasing smaller nationalism [i.e. for places like Hungary, Poland, Greece etc] that often has a darker tone as well are strengthened by such people because their stance is so extreme. As you may have guessed or seen from my comments elsewhere a personal bugbear of mine.
Steve
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I'm not saying that bad things didn't happen in the European colonial period but a lot of bad things happened elsewhere as well and most of the wealth of the early industrial age was built on the backs of Europeans not non-Europeans. Similarly the primary reason for most of the big wars in the last few centuries in Europe were less squabbles between independent nations that one power seeking to impose its will on everybody else, which is exactly what the ECA is trying to do here, although hopefully not militarily.
" class="smile"] I'm not saying that bad things didn't happen in the European colonial period but a lot of bad things happened elsewhere as well and most of the wealth of the early industrial age was built on the backs of Europeans not non-Europeans. Similarly the primary reason for most of the big wars in the last few centuries in Europe were less squabbles between independent nations that one power seeking to impose its will on everybody else, which is exactly what the ECA is trying to do here, although hopefully not militarily.