lordroel
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Post by lordroel on Jan 4, 2020 20:47:06 GMT
'US Vanishes On September 11th, 2001'. On one hand, Al-Qaeda would have no World Trade Centers to fly its hijacked planes into. But on the other, something far worse for the world has happened: the world's sole superpower and premier bastion of economic, military and technological might has disappeared to God knows where. Seems it was already made into a book series Zyobot called: Without Warning (Birmingham novel) |
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Zyobot
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Post by Zyobot on Jan 4, 2020 21:11:32 GMT
'US Vanishes On September 11th, 2001'. On one hand, Al-Qaeda would have no World Trade Centers to fly its hijacked planes into. But on the other, something far worse for the world has happened: the world's sole superpower and premier bastion of economic, military and technological might has disappeared to God knows where. Seems it was already made into a book series Zyobot called: Without Warning (Birmingham novel)Yeah, I've seen something like that before. Although, I think what you're referring to features the 2003 US vanishing without a trace, rather than its 2001 counterpart while it was on the brink of 9/11. |
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lordroel
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Post by lordroel on Jan 4, 2020 21:16:06 GMT
Yeah, I've seen something like that before. Although, I think what you're referring to features the 2003 US vanishing without a trace, rather than its 2001 counterpart while it was on the brink of 9/11. Well there will be no 9/11 as nobody will know a terrorist attacked happen there as there is no United States anymore, now 9/11 will be remembered as they day the United States vanished. |
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Zyobot
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Post by Zyobot on Jan 4, 2020 21:21:32 GMT
Yeah, I've seen something like that before. Although, I think what you're referring to features the 2003 US vanishing without a trace, rather than its 2001 counterpart while it was on the brink of 9/11. Well there will be no 9/11 as nobody will know a terrorist attacked happen there as there is no United States anymore, now 9/11 will be remembered as they day the United States vanished. Indeed. That's actually more of a secondary implication of the scenario I just proposed, with the primary one being that the global hegemony and guarantor of military might and trade throughout the Western hemisphere has forever vanished.
Obviously, I predict global chaos followed by the mother of all economic crashes--before burgeoning authoritarian powers like Russia and China "step in" to assert themselves through invasive, potentially even violent means. Yeah, it'll be a real crapsack world to the point where the people who disappeared in America will probably have been the lucky ones. Yay.
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lordroel
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Post by lordroel on Jan 4, 2020 21:25:39 GMT
Well there will be no 9/11 as nobody will know a terrorist attacked happen there as there is no United States anymore, now 9/11 will be remembered as they day the United States vanished. Indeed. That's actually more of a secondary implication of the scenario I just proposed, with the primary one being that the global hegemony and guarantor of military might and trade throughout the Western hemisphere has forever vanished. Obviously, I predict global chaos followed by the mother of all economic crashes--before burgeoning authoritarian powers like Russia and China "step in" to assert themselves through invasive, potentially even violent means. Yeah, it'll be a real crapsack world to the point where the people who disappeared in America will probably have been the lucky ones. Yay.
Russia gets Alaska back, Cuba takes Florida, Mexico takes back its old territory and the EU will settle together with Canada all Americans who live abroad in New England/New York region. |
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Zyobot
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Post by Zyobot on Jan 4, 2020 21:27:37 GMT
Indeed. That's actually more of a secondary implication of the scenario I just proposed, with the primary one being that the global hegemony and guarantor of military might and trade throughout the Western hemisphere has forever vanished. Obviously, I predict global chaos followed by the mother of all economic crashes--before burgeoning authoritarian powers like Russia and China "step in" to assert themselves through invasive, potentially even violent means. Yeah, it'll be a real crapsack world to the point where the people who disappeared in America will probably have been the lucky ones. Yay.
Russia gets Alaska back, Cuba takes Florida, Mexico takes back its old territory and the EU will settle together with Canada all Americans who live abroad in New England/New York region. Probably. I assume that the areas they claim for themselves would be "virgin Earth" zones, which--though costly to resettle from scratch--would provide their share of natural resources to exploit, i.e. untouched oil fields in Alaska that Russia would try to take advantage of. |
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lordroel
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Post by lordroel on Jan 4, 2020 21:31:23 GMT
Russia gets Alaska back, Cuba takes Florida, Mexico takes back its old territory and the EU will settle together with Canada all Americans who live abroad in New England/New York region. Probably. I assume that the areas they claim for themselves would be "virgin Earth" zones, which--though costly to resettle from scratch--would provide their share of natural resources to exploit, i.e. untouched oil fields in Alaska that Russia would try to take advantage of. But Canada also could move into Alaska, i think they might beat the Russians in that as they do not need to cross the Bering Strait. Hawaii might become Japanese/American Forces in Japan and Korea possession. |
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Zyobot
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Post by Zyobot on Jan 4, 2020 23:38:34 GMT
Probably. I assume that the areas they claim for themselves would be "virgin Earth" zones, which--though costly to resettle from scratch--would provide their share of natural resources to exploit, i.e. untouched oil fields in Alaska that Russia would try to take advantage of. But Canada also could move into Alaska, i think they might beat the Russians in that as they do not need to cross the Bering Strait. Hawaii might become Japanese/American Forces in Japan and Korea possession. As far as proximity goes, Canada might beat Russia to Alaska's oil reserves. But what if Russia threatens them with military force?
I'd mostly agree with you on Hawaii, though.
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lordroel
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Post by lordroel on Jan 5, 2020 1:47:32 GMT
But Canada also could move into Alaska, i think they might beat the Russians in that as they do not need to cross the Bering Strait. Hawaii might become Japanese/American Forces in Japan and Korea possession. As far as proximity goes, Canada might beat Russia to Alaska's oil reserves. But what if Russia threatens them with military force? I'd mostly agree with you on Hawaii, though.
Why would Russia do that, Canada still has the United Kingdom to back it up if needed. |
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Post by Zyobot on Jan 5, 2020 13:49:52 GMT
As far as proximity goes, Canada might beat Russia to Alaska's oil reserves. But what if Russia threatens them with military force? I'd mostly agree with you on Hawaii, though.
Why would Russia do that, Canada still has the United Kingdom to back it up if needed. Alright, that’s true. Where else might Russia try to take land (or sea) from, I wonder? |
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lordroel
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Post by lordroel on Jan 5, 2020 13:52:19 GMT
Why would Russia do that, Canada still has the United Kingdom to back it up if needed. Alright, that’s true. Where else might Russia try to take land (or sea) from, I wonder? Not try to take land, but focus more on Europe and the Middle East now the United States are gone. |
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Post by Zyobot on Jan 5, 2020 14:07:07 GMT
Alright, that’s true. Where else might Russia try to take land (or sea) from, I wonder? Not try to take land, but focus more on Europe and the Middle East now the United States are gone. True. I suppose it’s not as easy to do either with a vast American presence in both places, now is it? |
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lordroel
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Post by lordroel on Jan 5, 2020 14:17:59 GMT
Not try to take land, but focus more on Europe and the Middle East now the United States are gone. True. I suppose it’s not as easy to do either with a vast American presence in both places, now is it? All US forces that are in Europe, will now most likely be redeployed to secure as much of former United States as they can. |
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Post by stevep on Jan 5, 2020 15:40:30 GMT
Russia gets Alaska back, Cuba takes Florida, Mexico takes back its old territory and the EU will settle together with Canada all Americans who live abroad in New England/New York region. Probably. I assume that the areas they claim for themselves would be "virgin Earth" zones, which--though costly to resettle from scratch--would provide their share of natural resources to exploit, i.e. untouched oil fields in Alaska that Russia would try to take advantage of.
Damn I had a fairly long post which due to some finger problems suddenly died! Trying again.
From what's said this is a replaced by virgin earth rather than ocean so ecological impacts are going to be less, which is a good thing. Also US people and forces/equipment overseas and at sea are unaffected so a lot of its SSBN force is still available - at least until lack of spares and equipment causes problems. This would be a problem for Britain as well in the longer term as Trident depends on a lot of support from the US including a shared missile pool. Going to have to be a lot of urgent spending and readjustment to maintain a nuclear capacity by either power in the longer term. Are American overseas territories affected or just the states?
However in the shorter term this is likely to enable a maintaining of some political stability. Your likely to see a coalition of the NATO members along with some other allies working with the remaining US forces and people to maintain the territorial integrity of the 'country'. Faced with this and the US nuclear forces, at least for a while its unlikely that anyone would seriously challenge this. However you could have some annexation to settlement from Mexico say as migrants move in, which would be difficult to prevent. Cuba is unlikely to make a military move for Florida but could well seek to reclaim Guantanamo Bay.
I suspect that problems are more likely to be in areas where stability has been maintained with US support. For instance N Korea could become more aggressive if they see US forces and support removed for the south. Russia is probably too weak at this point and the west hasn't drawn down its forces so much that a major attack on western interest would occur. Although depending on the connections at the time Putin might make a bid for say the Baltic states, or at least to put pressure on them to 'confirm' to his desires. Alternatively Russia, Iran and possibly also Turkey might also 'fish in troubled waters' in the ME. Also while they might stay legally active without US military support sanctions on Iraq are likely to be significantly weakened in reality.
Ironically you might see a reversal of an old AH meme, with a North American Union be achieved by a Canadian absorption of the US. 
I've largely left out economic impact as while definitely huge its going to be difficult to tell the way things will develop. The world has lost its largest exporter of foodstuffs and supplier of a lot of technology and the internet is going to take a big hit with many servers and suppliers of technology suddenly gone. Its also lost a big market for a lot of goods while a lot of ownership issues will be raised. Many foreign businesses will have lost property and other assets in the US and the position of a lot of US owned assets overseas will be uncertain. With the dollar effectively gone the world will need to find a new trading currency while what happens with international debt. E Asia would be hit hard by the fact their buying of US debt has basically become worthless while a lot of debts by other countries and institutions overseas also effectively gone, which would make them happy, at least in the short term.
The world economy is going to be in a mess for some time, having only just started to recover from the Asia debt crisis of the late 1990s. How badly nations are affected and who comes out well or badly will depend on too many factors to tell.
Ecologically things will be mixed. The world has lost one of its biggest polluters but also a major source of knowledge about new technology. Also if it is a virgin earth replacement there's going to be a lot of oil and gas in known areas in the US which could see further CO2 production in future decades! - On this point what happens to off-shore resources such as drilling rigs and the like? Are they gone or still there?
Also most of the eastern part of the country has seen deep forests restored and if no humans are present do you have a lot of large animals who died off after the arrival of humans in N America still there?
Anyway an interesting but somewhat frightening scenario which is going to have some big impacts on the last couple of decades.
Steve
PS something in my 1st post I just remembered. If any of the SSBN commanders at sea who assumes the sudden loss of all contact with home is as a result of a nuclear attack they could react violently and things turn very bad very quickly.
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lordroel
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Post by lordroel on Jan 5, 2020 15:43:01 GMT
PS something in my 1st post I just remembered. If any of the SSBN commanders at sea who assumes the sudden loss of all contact with home is as a result of a nuclear attack they could react violently and things turn very bad very quickly.
Wait is that not how British boomer sub captains do it, listen to BBC and if it is not there, then World War III. |
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