WI: No Sun Yat-sen

[Taunay]

Sun Yat-sen was without a doubt a very important figure of the Chinese 20th century. He had an essential role in overthrowing the Qing dynasty and establishing a republic in China, with him as the first (provisional) president.
While Qing China was without a doubt extremely weak by the start of the 20th century, it's undeniable that Sun's role in overthrowing the imperial government is very big, as he - through his work as a political philosopher - gathered the intellectuals into joining his Republican ideals about how China should be run.
All that being said, it makes one wonder how different China would look without him.
Assuming that Sun Yat-sen never exists, who would replace him (Chiang Kai-shek, Huang Xing, Song Jiaoren)? Could this guarantee that the Qing dynasty would still fall? How different would the early Chinese republic be without him?

[raunchel]

Jan 6, 2023 1:24:56 GMT Taunay said:

Sun Yat-sen was without a doubt a very important figure of the Chinese 20th century. He had an essential role in overthrowing the Qing dynasty and establishing a republic in China, with him as the first (provisional) president.
While Qing China was without a doubt extremely weak by the start of the 20th century, it's undeniable that Sun's role in overthrowing the imperial government is very big, as he - through his work as a political philosopher - gathered the intellectuals into joining his Republican ideals about how China should be run.
All that being said, it makes one wonder how different China would look without him.
Assuming that Sun Yat-sen never exists, who would replace him (Chiang Kai-shek, Huang Xing, Song Jiaoren)? Could this guarantee that the Qing dynasty would still fall? How different would the early Chinese republic be without him?

The Qing would still fall. They were very weak and stood against any kind of modernisation which was increasing in China at the time. Without Sun Yat-Sen things would certainly look different and I think that people who only really rose to prominence in his footsteps wouldn't get all that far.

But you could have a longer living Yeung Ku-wan for instance. He would have the revolutionary credentials and leadership to rise to greater prominence if he hadn't been killed.

[Max Sinister]

Dunno what you think about the TL Superpower Empire: China 1912, which has Yuan Shikai die in 1912, after which Kang Youwei, former leader of the "Hundred Days" reform movement, becomes new president - and soon emperor.

The author is a Sinologist, that should count for something.