Hirohito tried For War Crimes

[mspence]

Sorry if this has been done before, but WI the Emperor had been tried? MacArthur chose not to do it because the US occupation of Japan would have been far more difficult if he had been, but WI MacArthur is killed in the Philippines and someone else takes his place? What would the trial have looked like, what would Hirohito's sentence have been, and how do the Japanese people react?

[stevep]

Mar 13, 2023 12:40:30 GMT mspence said:

Sorry if this has been done before, but WI the Emperor had been tried? MacArthur chose not to do it because the US occupation of Japan would have been far more difficult if he had been, but WI MacArthur is killed in the Philippines and someone else takes his place? What would the trial have looked like, what would Hirohito's sentence have been, and how do the Japanese people react?

  Very difficult to tell because the imperial status was so important for many in Japan at the time.  They had been brought to believe he was literally divine.  IIRC it was the only demand that the Japanese made and the US accepted for the OTL surrender.  Albeit with some fudge factors in terms of it being left formally vague.

  As such you could need further nuclear strikes and possibly even an actual invasion without a concession on this point.  That would be very costly, especially a successful invasion which would mean tens if not hundreds of thousands of US deaths and probably the Japanese toll in the millions.  As a result feeling on both sides would be a lot harsher toward the other and expect probably a continued terror war with attacks on US and 'collaborating' officials and harsh repression of suspected opponents of the occupation.

  Another factor here could be that the hard left in Japan could become a significant factor with more people rejected the other two alternatives.

[gillan1220]

The Emperor was the only thing keeping order in post-war Japan. Hence the U.S. did not want to face an uprising on their hands. Any form of uprising would overexhaust the U.S. and allies who were war-weary after fighting six years of World War II.

It would also invite the Japanese communists into mainstream Japanese politics, something the U.S. does not want to happen especially after seeing the Soviets becoming the next threat in the post-war world.

[miletus12]

Mar 13, 2023 17:20:41 GMT stevep said:

As such you could need further nuclear strikes and possibly even an actual invasion without a concession on this point.  That would be very costly, especially a successful invasion which would mean tens if not hundreds of thousands of US deaths and probably the Japanese toll in the millions.  As a result feeling on both sides would be a lot harsher toward the other and expect probably a continued terror war with attacks on US and 'collaborating' officials and harsh repression of suspected opponents of the occupation.

The arguments about DOWNFALL at the time were based on a statistical science based operation research of what the Americans encountered. They knew with some certainty how many Americans would perish in the (Army) operation. The big question was how many Japanese would die. Low estimates were 5 million. High estimates were 3x that number.

The two different tracks for the conclusion of the war, were Navy and Army. The Army wanted to get ashore and shoot the islands up. This would have resulted in about a mean of 300,000 American casualties and those millions of Japanese deaths. The Navy wanted blockade and air bombardment. This was expected to result in 10,000 US casualties. The NAVY got its way. The Japanese died to the tune of about 750,000. All of it was horrible, but it was much better than what the Army wanted.

As for Hirohito, he was kept around because the Americans wanted to do psyops on the Japanese people. Make them study war no more. The Japanese had proven they were good at it, and who wanted them to cut loose again?



The Navy got its way and MacArthur, (^^^) who was not the boob British historians claim, got his. The "emperor" was reduced to a mere "small" man.

[Max Sinister]

Considered that the emperor was worshipped as a divine being, he didn't seem to have used this to influence history in a significant, positive way.

[gillan1220]

Mar 18, 2023 21:00:50 GMT Max Sinister said:

Considered that the emperor was worshipped as a divine being, he didn't seem to have used this to influence history in a significant, positive way.

Having Hirohito tried and executed would martyr him as divine and immortal. He was necessary to maintain order. Hirohito's "divine" status was only abolished in 1947 when the post-war constitution came whereas the Emperor was merely a symbolic figurehead.