JFK Never Assasinated?

[mrsticka]

November 22nd, 1963–
President John F. Kennedy still rides through Dallas in his motorcade along with his wife Jackie and Texas Governor John B. Connally.  And thre's no assassination attempt on his life.  Instead, Kennedy makes it to his intended destination to discuss campaign fundraising.

1964-
Kennedy runs for reelection.  He wins in a landslide defeating Barry Goldwater.

[lordroel]

Apr 21, 2023 1:17:06 GMT mrsticka said:

November 22nd, 1963–
President John F. Kennedy still rides through Dallas in his motorcade along with his wife Jackie and Texas Governor John B. Connally.  And thre's no assassination attempt on his life.  Instead, Kennedy makes it to his intended destination to discuss campaign fundraising.

1964-
Kennedy runs for reelection.  He wins in a landslide defeating Barry Goldwater.

Let the Wall Street Journal speak, there are other but i picked this one.

Imagining a Second JFK Term

[michelvan]

There two thing that not gonna happen under Kennedy second Term.

The Civil Right Act fo 1964
The Apollo Program

Paradox it was dead of Kennedy that push both true Capitol Hill,
There's a tiny chance that for Civil Right Act, but i think that southern Democrats would block it.

On Apollo, i think it would face same dead like the Constellation program of 2000s
first Budgets cuts, then cancelation on Saturn V and end with Apollo one fire, Capitol Hill will kill the program.
Could be that MOL is transfer from USAF to NASA and become civilian station "Skylab"

Other issue, i think that Kennedy fell in same trap as LBJ in Vietnam conflict that escalate into Vietnam War.

health issue, JFK was Sick, suffering of Addison's disease, spinal problems that gave him terrible back pain.
He took cocktail of drugs with allot side effects, its very realistic that JKF could have died in office during second term !

Scandals, do drugs side effects, special the steroids, JFK had "bull like libido" and allot of Affairs,
With Marilyn Monroe, Judith Campbell, Mary Pinchot Meyer, Marlene Dietrich, Mimi Alford, and his wife's press secretary, Pamela Turnure and alleged East German spy Ellen Rometsch.
Each of them could trigger "Lewinsky" scandal in Capitol Hill and congress try Impeach JFK.

Under this aspects
JFK could end up in History book not as "shining historical figure"
But as failure, who brought the World to edge of Nuclear War, who gave USA the Vietnam Wars and political scandals that shock the nation.

Although had things went terrible wrong on October 1962
Had JFK ended up in History book as "The biggest mass murderer since Adolf Hitler"

[mrsticka]

Well, I know there are some people who wonder what if he wasn't assassinated.

[Max Sinister]

Why should JFK cancel Apollo if he was the guy who had the idea to put a man on the Moon, just because it's possible?

But yes, he'd be blamed for Vietnam indeed. Considering this, he was paradoxically lucky not to get blamed for it. (Or would his charisma help him to deflect the blame onto s/o else?)

And why did his death help the Civil Rights Act?

About Marilyn... yeah, does anyone know why the press didn't find out and reveal it in OTL?

[lordroel]

Apr 22, 2023 7:25:38 GMT Max Sinister said:

Why should JFK cancel Apollo if he was the guy who had the idea to put a man on the Moon, just because it's possible?

Seems in private JFK had doubts if we go according to this article: If President Kennedy hadn’t been killed, would we have landed on the Moon on July 20, 1969? It seems unlikely.

In private, though, Kennedy viewed going to the Moon not as a natural expression of the American spirit, but in pragmatic political terms. He had picked the Moon as the goal in order to beat the Soviets in space. For Kennedy, Apollo was a Cold War mission: to re-establish American pre-eminence in science, technology, and engineering.

[Max Sinister]

Apr 22, 2023 8:43:32 GMT lordroel said:

Apr 22, 2023 7:25:38 GMT Max Sinister said:

Why should JFK cancel Apollo if he was the guy who had the idea to put a man on the Moon, just because it's possible?

Seems in private JFK had doubts if we go according to this article: If President Kennedy hadn’t been killed, would we have landed on the Moon on July 20, 1969? It seems unlikely.

In private, though, Kennedy viewed going to the Moon not as a natural expression of the American spirit, but in pragmatic political terms. He had picked the Moon as the goal in order to beat the Soviets in space. For Kennedy, Apollo was a Cold War mission: to re-establish American pre-eminence in science, technology, and engineering.

Hm, so he wasn't really interested in it personally (unlike the many space tourists), but supported it nonetheless.

It'd certainly hurt him if some other POTUS would harvest his fame, but I can't see him cancel it. Too many interests involved. Superfluous projects have lived which were less justified.

[lordroel]

Apr 22, 2023 9:30:42 GMT Max Sinister said:

Apr 22, 2023 8:43:32 GMT lordroel said:

Seems in private JFK had doubts if we go according to this article: If President Kennedy hadn’t been killed, would we have landed on the Moon on July 20, 1969? It seems unlikely.

In private, though, Kennedy viewed going to the Moon not as a natural expression of the American spirit, but in pragmatic political terms. He had picked the Moon as the goal in order to beat the Soviets in space. For Kennedy, Apollo was a Cold War mission: to re-establish American pre-eminence in science, technology, and engineering.

Hm, so he wasn't really interested in it personally (unlike the many space tourists), but supported it nonetheless.

It'd certainly hurt him if some other POTUS would harvest his fame, but I can't see him cancel it. Too many interests involved. Superfluous projects have lived which were less justified.

As always, it is politics, JFK getting killed i think saved the Apollo program.

[michelvan]

Apr 22, 2023 7:25:38 GMT Max Sinister said:

Why should JFK cancel Apollo if he was the guy who had the idea to put a man on the Moon, just because it's possible?

But yes, he'd be blamed for Vietnam indeed. Considering this, he was paradoxically lucky not to get blamed for it. (Or would his charisma help him to deflect the blame onto s/o else?)

And why did his death help the Civil Rights Act?

About Marilyn... yeah, does anyone know why the press didn't find out and reveal it in OTL?

Its not JFK would cancel Apollo, but US congress and Senat !
There were other proposals IPP (Nixon) Space Exploration initiative (Bush Sr) and Constellation program (Bush Jr), who simply ignored or got canceled by Capitol Hill.
After Kennedy assassination the Apollo program became his legacy, just like the Civil Right Act of 1964.

LBJ as new President pushed Civil right act true Congress and Senat, he even went so far to personal intimidate and threaten US politicians that opposed the bill !
Allot US politicians were the consensual opinion to vote for it to honour the Dead President.

With Kennedy alive thing would be different, he would face hostile Congress and Senate.
Like powerful souther democrats who opposed the new civil right act.
If LBJ could act as Vice in same way as President in OTL is doubtful.

It even realistic that JFK got blackmailed by opposition to bill, with affairs like Marilyn Monroe, or his mafia "connections" or that Ellen Rometsch is communist spy
Each of those could have damage seriously JFK reputation and his Administration, in similar way as watergate or Lewinsky affaire !
FBI director Hoover had allot dossier about JFK little dirty secrets, ready to use if needed...


This would let far different USA as we know it:
JFK second term ended as he died of Addison's disease in White House, LBJ become President with shorten term of office in US History,
do health issue he not attend for 1968 election,
won by Richard m. Nixon, He face several big problems the Kennedy Administration left behind.
The escalating Vietnam War like OTL and ongoing races issue now on level of uprise in 1968 after assassination of Martin Luther King !
Nixon is skilled ruthless politician, who could push the new civil right act true Congress and Senat !
making allot of enemies in the process

It would ironic if Nixon is assassinated because of this, during his 1972 election campaign in town called Dallas
while Spiro Agnew become the new US President...

[miletus12]

Apr 21, 2023 8:26:05 GMT michelvan said:

Other issue, i think that Kennedy fell in same trap as LBJ in Vietnam conflict that escalate into Vietnam War.

I am of two minds.

Kennedy appointed that idiot, McNamara, on a bad recommendation. He might have or might not have followed the war criminal, McNamara's advice subsequently as he learned what an idiot McNamara was from the Cuban Missile Crisis. It depends upon on whether Kennedy had Johnson's hubris and pride, or whether (As I believe far more likely from the excellent quality of character he exhibited after the PT 109 disaster, when he mishandled the evasion maneuver and the Japanese destroyer sliced his boat in two; he accepted responsibility and acted in the best interests of his men and of his navy and then himself. M.), he would either avoid the mistake or correct it.

That is, he did make the initial mistake in Vietnam, but I think he would not have compounded it.