Miscellaneous, Non-Frivolous ASB Ideas

[Zyobot]

‘Tsar Nicholas II Learns Future History Up To 2020’. What kinds of changes could he make in avoiding his OTL fate and putting his beloved Russia on a more desirable path, I wonder?

[lordroel]

Dec 3, 2019 18:39:22 GMT Zyobot said:

‘Tsar Nicholas II Learns Future History Up To 2020’. What kinds of changes could he make in avoiding his OTL fate and putting his beloved Russia on a more desirable path, I wonder?

What year, before the Russian-Japanese war ore before the Great War.

[Zyobot]

Dec 3, 2019 18:57:39 GMT lordroel said:

Dec 3, 2019 18:39:22 GMT Zyobot said:

‘Tsar Nicholas II Learns Future History Up To 2020’. What kinds of changes could he make in avoiding his OTL fate and putting his beloved Russia on a more desirable path, I wonder?

What year, before the Russian-Japanese war ore before the Great War.

Good question. Before the Russo-Japanese War works--more specifically, shortly after his coronation in May 1896.

[lordroel]

Dec 3, 2019 19:15:38 GMT Zyobot said:

Dec 3, 2019 18:57:39 GMT lordroel said:

What year, before the Russian-Japanese war ore before the Great War.

Good question. Before the Russo-Japanese War works--more specifically, shortly after his coronation in May 1896.

Then i hoop he end the current Absolute monarchy and go to a model like the British rule, becoming a parliament democracy, not what it had become in 1905 but a true parliament democracy.

[Zyobot]

Dec 3, 2019 19:30:33 GMT lordroel said:

Dec 3, 2019 19:15:38 GMT Zyobot said:

Good question. Before the Russo-Japanese War works--more specifically, shortly after his coronation in May 1896.

Then i hoop he end the current Absolute monarchy and go to a model like the British rule, becoming a parliament democracy, not what it had become in 1905 but a true parliament democracy.

True. Not only am I hoping that allows Russia to avoid the Bolshevik Revolution and its eventual fall to communism as follows, but I’m also wondering if liberalization would prompt more economic growth and development.

Granted, I’m aware that OTL Tsarist Russia was probably still industrializing more than most would think. However, it was nowhere near the Capitalist West until Soviet modernization efforts took hold—though there may have been better, less destructive ways to get comparable results in hindsight.

[stevep]

Dec 3, 2019 18:39:22 GMT Zyobot said:

‘Tsar Nicholas II Learns Future History Up To 2020’. What kinds of changes could he make in avoiding his OTL fate and putting his beloved Russia on a more desirable path, I wonder?

  He would have to change his entire mindset.  There is the danger he could conclude that it needs more autocracy to prevent dissent breaking out, plus selecting different officials to avoid ones he decides aren't loyal/efficient enough.  Which might depend on what version of future events he learns as different historians, let alone societies will have different interpretations to events.  Which might or might not work for a while at least.

  On the other hand, if he gets this knowledge when his coronation occurred, he has a good amount of time to change things and was only 26 at the coronation and actually came to the throne 18 months earlier in Nov 1894 so if it happened then is even younger.  As such he might drastically change his behaviour, although again that could come in a number of ways.  For instance I could see a certain Vladimir Ilyich Ulyanov, aka Lenin having a somewhat shorter and more brutal life, which might possibly save millions of lives or even cause more deaths.

  I wonder if he would decide to avoid war with Germany at all costs or go for a more militarised Russia and possibly have somewhat better planning for the war with Japan.  In which case that could easily have gone the other way as Japan was by some reports very close of economic/fiscal exhaustion by the end of the war.  Which would have huge butterflies as Japan would remain a markedly smaller military and political figure and without the weaknesses perceived in Russia in 1904/05, especially if no revolution and forced introduction of a Duma as a result that could have a lot of impacts. 

  Also what if he has a son without hemophilia?  That would probably butterfly Rasputin and the poisonous impact that had, although he could well fail to have a role anyway if Nicholas has any sense.

  Ideally he would support at least some real democratic reform but that was very much against his mindset and also he was opposed by a lot of powerful figures in the establishment.  Plus the general view seems to be that he was rather weak willed and tended to be easily driven by more determined people around him.

[Zyobot]

I proposed this match-up once earlier, but much more briefly than is true now: ‘1944 FDR Vs. 1984 Ronald Reagan’ in yet another cross-time presidential election. For this scenario, the 1984 Western US gets sent forty years back in time to January 1st, 1944 or thereabouts. And, hopefully, the two Americas agree to hold an election on schedule.

Personally, I can see a GOP icon who rails against big government like Reagan making quite a foil for the progressive, New-Dealer Roosevelt as they spar over policy and battle for the title of most charismatic, leadership-worthy candidate in the eyes of the American people. This may be less so with Generation X folks and Baby Boomers, but I can see uptimer members of the Greatest, Silent and probably also Lost Generation being more divided in their support for either Reagan or Roosevelt; they likely have found memories of him and last reverence of FDR as the decisive, oratorically gifted wartime leader who led America to a lasting victory, after all.

Unfortunately, FDR is also plagued by health issues that have since become public knowledge in 1980-something, which may reduce his support amongst downtimers as well. Policy-wise, I wonder if he may be too economically progressive for Reagan’s America, never mind how he probably can’t be as vocal about civil rights legislation as uptimers would like him to be due to the attitudes of 1940s America. That also excludes the possibility that he might get attacked for being too “soft” or “generous” with Stalinist Russia as it strong-armed Eastern Europe IOTL; how he’ll defend himself and proclaim a sufficiently fervent hatred for communism and determination to get tough on Soviet encroachment (even though Lend-Lease is still going on, I’m aware), I don’t know.

Meanwhile, could FDR’s right-wing political opponents in the downtimer US decide that Reagan—hopefully unlike Hoover, Landon, Wilkie, and Dewey—is their best shot at getting Roosevelt out of office, and lend their support to his re-election bid accordingly?

[Zyobot]

‘Only US Has Nukes From 1945 Onwards’. Maybe the USSR would be a whole lot less bold in the long term, considering that the Kremlin and its allies would have access to no such weaponry themselves.

[Zyobot]

'2050 Democratic Asia-Pacific To 1950'.

[Zyobot]

‘2020 Middle America To 1980’—with President Trump coming along for the ride to represent the uptimers and their interests. This would belong in ‘Politics and Current Affairs’ more than anywhere else, especially with the current POTUS being present.

Still, it’ll be a real hoot to see Ronald Reagan upstaged by Donald the Elder in this year’s election. But what the rest of the downtimers make of our contemporary life and political situation, I don’t know.

[lordroel]

Dec 15, 2019 15:57:00 GMT Zyobot said:

‘2020 Middle America To 1980’—with President Trump coming along for the ride to represent the uptimers and their interests. This would belong in ‘Politics and Current Affairs’ more than anywhere else, especially with the current POTUS being present.

Still, it’ll be a real hoot to see Ronald Reagan upstaged by Donald the Elder in this year’s election. But what the rest of the downtimers make of our contemporary life and political situation, I don’t know.

True, as i mentioned already in the Unsure Where to Put Proposed Thread?, this would fall in the Politics and Current Affairs board, but unless you can predict the future Zyobot, we do not yet know if Trump gets a second term and thus this would be considered Alternate Future History. 

[Zyobot]

Dec 15, 2019 16:03:56 GMT lordroel said:

Dec 15, 2019 15:57:00 GMT Zyobot said:

‘2020 Middle America To 1980’—with President Trump coming along for the ride to represent the uptimers and their interests. This would belong in ‘Politics and Current Affairs’ more than anywhere else, especially with the current POTUS being present.

Still, it’ll be a real hoot to see Ronald Reagan upstaged by Donald the Elder in this year’s election. But what the rest of the downtimers make of our contemporary life and political situation, I don’t know.

True, as i mentioned already in the Unsure Where to Put Proposed Thread?, this would fall in the Politics and Current Affairs board, but unless you can predict the future Zyobot, we do not yet know if Trump gets a second term and thus this would be considered Alternate Future History. 

Understood. I guess I should’ve been more specific and said that Middle America as of January 1st, 2020 gets sent to January 1st, 1980–which leaves eleven months of campaigning, meaning that Trump’s chances of getting a second term are still up in the air.

[lordroel]

Dec 15, 2019 16:19:38 GMT Zyobot said:

Dec 15, 2019 16:03:56 GMT lordroel said:

True, as i mentioned already in the Unsure Where to Put Proposed Thread?, this would fall in the Politics and Current Affairs board, but unless you can predict the future Zyobot, we do not yet know if Trump gets a second term and thus this would be considered Alternate Future History. 

Understood. I guess I should’ve been more specific and said that Middle America as of January 1st, 2020 gets sent to January 1st, 1980–which leaves eleven months of campaigning, meaning that Trump’s chances of getting a second term are still up in the air.

That is better.

[Zyobot]

Dec 15, 2019 16:30:21 GMT lordroel said:

Dec 15, 2019 16:19:38 GMT Zyobot said:

Understood. I guess I should’ve been more specific and said that Middle America as of January 1st, 2020 gets sent to January 1st, 1980–which leaves eleven months of campaigning, meaning that Trump’s chances of getting a second term are still up in the air.

That is better.

Good. With modern Middle America in the picture and all of the future knowledge that will be disseminated to the rest of the world, the 1980 election may well be even more pivotal than IOTL.

[Zyobot]

‘2009 US To 1939’. For one thing, resolving World War Two—which was originally slated to commence that same year—will be one of President Obama’s first tests as POTUS.