A better Philippine Air Force in the Cold War to present day

[lordroel]

Dec 14, 2020 17:27:37 GMT gillan1220 said:

Dec 14, 2020 17:25:57 GMT lordroel said:

So if there was a lesser 1997-98 Asian Financial Crisis, could the PAF be stronger. 

Yes, the PAF would have been capable especially with those Hornets which was the closest modern fighter jet especially for that time. We would have seen PAF, USMC, and USN Hornets flying side-by-side during Balikatan 2002 and the following exercises to come.

Only if the PAF had the funding to keep them in the air i assume.

[La Rouge Beret]

The SAAB 340 AEW & C platform would be the right fit for the Philippines, since it is able to be operated on smaller airfields and is more affordable to run given that it uses turboprops. It is also used by Brasil, which could open up multiple other avenues. Another interim fast jet option for the PAF could be the Canadian CF - 5s that received a huge upgrade to act as lead in aircraft for their CF 18s and later sat in storage awaiting buyers. While Botswana ended up with them IOTL, a better outcome could be the PAF using them until the threat rises from China to justify a capability upgrade.

With regards to the UH 60 buy, the Mil 17 carries more troops is easier to maintain and far more rugged as well. However, I would compliment it with a Ch 47 buy as well and you have a pretty strong air wing capability, particularly if that is combined with Caribous or other STOL transport aircraft.

[gillan1220]

Dec 15, 2020 2:07:57 GMT La Rouge Beret said:

The SAAB 340 AEW & C platform would be the right fit for the Philippines, since it is able to be operated on smaller airfields and is more affordable to run given that it uses turboprops. It is also used by Brasil, which could open up multiple other avenues. Another interim fast jet option for the PAF could be the Canadian CF - 5s that received a huge upgrade to act as lead in aircraft for their CF 18s and later sat in storage awaiting buyers. While Botswana ended up with them IOTL, a better outcome could be the PAF using them until the threat rises from China to justify a capability upgrade.

With regards to the UH 60 buy, the Mil 17 carries more troops is easier to maintain and far more rugged as well. However, I would compliment it with a Ch 47 buy as well and you have a pretty strong air wing capability, particularly if that is combined with Caribous or other STOL transport aircraft.

This looks pretty fitting for the Philippine Air Force indeed.


The Mi-17 was considered in the early years of the Duterte administration. Even with CAATSA, both Janes and CNN Philippines reports that PAF has ordered at least 12 of these helicopters.

[TheRomanSlayer]

Perhaps mounting the Avenger's missile system on an M551 Sheridan chassis could be a good fit, though being an amphibious light tank the original M551, one might also say that having a good Surface to Air missile system while on the water might also help deter against enemy helicopters too.

Having a similar alliance to NORAD could enhance the defensive security of the Philippines in terms of air defenses, but that went out of the window with the demise of SEATO. Although would it be the regular Hornet or the Super Hornet that may be a good fit within the PAF. It might also depend on what kind of fighter planes that neighboring Malaysia, Indonesia and Vietnam would field that may also cover Philippine airspace.

[gillan1220]

Dec 15, 2020 4:37:01 GMT TheRomanSlayer said:

Perhaps mounting the Avenger's missile system on an M551 Sheridan chassis could be a good fit, though being an amphibious light tank the original M551, one might also say that having a good Surface to Air missile system while on the water might also help deter against enemy helicopters too.

Having a similar alliance to NORAD could enhance the defensive security of the Philippines in terms of air defenses, but that went out of the window with the demise of SEATO. Although would it be the regular Hornet or the Super Hornet that may be a good fit within the PAF. It might also depend on what kind of fighter planes that neighboring Malaysia, Indonesia and Vietnam would field that may also cover Philippine airspace.

A Hornet or even the Super Hornet would be a boost to the PAF. The Malaysians use the Hornet while the Indonesians use the F-16. Keep in mind that both these ASEAN countries also use the Sukhoi.

[La Rouge Beret]

The Hornet has super short legs, so if the PAF went down that route then they would also need to invest in tankers. Otherwise the F - 16 with a single engine reduces the logistical burden versus the F / A 18's twin engines, along with offering a huge amount of commonality for the PAF with multiple friendly Air Forces also operating the type within the region. Otherwise the Flanker has enormous legs and once you update the avionics would also provide a pretty potent capability.

The only issue with that is your primary adversary (PLAAF & PLAN) also operate them, but AEW & C will dramatically reduce that risk for you since most engagements won't reach the merge.

[TheRomanSlayer]

What does AEW & C stand for?

[La Rouge Beret]

Airborne Early Warning & Control - aircraft that identify air threats, prioritise them according to capability and then direct friendly fighters to engage them from an advantageous position. This dramatically reduces your fighter pilot's workload & improves their situational awareness.

[TheRomanSlayer]

OK. I honestly think having a strong AEW & C would be necessary in a country that has to cover multiple locations, being a nation with over 7,107 islands. I would also think that radar would also go well with AEW & C as well. How expensive are missile defenses are anyways?

[gillan1220]

Dec 16, 2020 5:22:39 GMT TheRomanSlayer said:

OK. I honestly think having a strong AEW & C would be necessary in a country that has to cover multiple locations, being a nation with over 7,107 islands. I would also think that radar would also go well with AEW & C as well. How expensive are missile defenses are anyways?

Patriot Missiles and THAAD are expensive no doubt.

[gillan1220]

If Japan was allowed to sell military hardware, the PAF may want to consider the Kawasaki C-1. Would be nice to see these turbofan transports since they have longer ranges than the Hercules and the C-295.

Photo: The EC-1 at Iruma Air Base (2011).

[lordroel]

Dec 17, 2020 11:44:01 GMT gillan1220 said:

If Japan was allowed to sell military hardware, the PAF may want to consider the Kawasaki C-1. Would be nice to see these turbofan transports since they have longer ranges than the Hercules and the C-295.

Photo: The EC-1 at Iruma Air Base (2011).

Think more Hercules transports for long range and some more CASA C-295s is better, also i would like to see this plane below in a nice camoflage like the C-1 you posted gillan1220.

[La Rouge Beret]

Agreed the C - 130 Hercules and the CASA C - 295 or even the AN 26 or 32 are more then enough plane for the PAF.

[TheRomanSlayer]

The EC-1 would have been a good transport plane for the paratroopers to use, though I wonder if it might be vulnerable to such weapons like the Stinger missiles carried on foot by infantry?

[gillan1220]

Dec 17, 2020 19:37:45 GMT lordroel said:

Think more Hercules transports for long range and some more CASA C-295s is better, also i would like to see this plane below in a nice camoflage like the C-1 you posted gillan1220.

I love the camo for the JSDF. It's unique. If the PAF were to get a C-1 in an alternate timeline, it would probably be in PAF grey color scheme.

Dec 18, 2020 2:27:59 GMT La Rouge Beret said:

Agreed the C - 130 Hercules and the CASA C - 295 or even the AN 26 or 32 are more then enough plane for the PAF.

A fourth C-130 is on stand-by for delivery to the Philippines.

Dec 18, 2020 5:53:40 GMT TheRomanSlayer said:

The EC-1 would have been a good transport plane for the paratroopers to use, though I wonder if it might be vulnerable to such weapons like the Stinger missiles carried on foot by infantry?

I think the C-1 would still be vulnerable to SAM systems just like the C-130 and the C-295. Thankfully, the insurgents are not armed with MANPADS systems.