lordroel
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Post by lordroel on Apr 25, 2020 12:50:56 GMT
Nope just several Southern states decided to go for a round 2. If you means that the 1860's attempt failed and some of them try again now I think the answer would be squash pretty damned quickly. With the exception of Texas which has seen fairly dramatic growth most of the old CSA has seen fairly dramatic relative decline in importance so they would be massively more outnumbered than the earlier attempt in the 1860's. Also with the advance of technology a broad industrial base is even more important and at this stage very little is in the old CSA region.
Could Germany send some troops to the Southern States, will the United Kingdom divert troops to Union ore will it be a Unions versus Southern States war only.
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stevep
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Post by stevep on Apr 25, 2020 14:05:50 GMT
If you means that the 1860's attempt failed and some of them try again now I think the answer would be squash pretty damned quickly. With the exception of Texas which has seen fairly dramatic growth most of the old CSA has seen fairly dramatic relative decline in importance so they would be massively more outnumbered than the earlier attempt in the 1860's. Also with the advance of technology a broad industrial base is even more important and at this stage very little is in the old CSA region.
Could Germany send some troops to the Southern States, will the United Kingdom divert troops to Union ore will it be a Unions versus Southern States war only.
That would depend on the circumstances. For instance: a) Is WWI occurring as OTL in Europe, In which case I would say certainly not as Germany is too busy fighting the EP and would also have great difficulty getting much if anything past the allied blockade. Plus since attempting to do this would be an act of war, especially if it was sending troops rather than just equipment. As such that would both harden opinion in the US against the south, as they could be portrayed as agents of a foreign power and also make very likely an earlier US dow on Germany which would see it moblising earlier and probably with more effort. Once the south was defeated you would probably see substantial US forces, with some battle experience, arriving and engaging in battle say by some time in 1917. A very, very bad move by Germany.
b) If its not occurring but still tension as in OTL then it could prompt a response from Britain or that could be an alternative trigger for a conflict in Europe. However unless Germany sent significant levels of military forces or, probably more likely equipment its unlikely to greatly alter the substantial power imbalance between the two American factions.
Steve
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lordroel
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Post by lordroel on Apr 25, 2020 16:48:00 GMT
Could Germany send some troops to the Southern States, will the United Kingdom divert troops to Union ore will it be a Unions versus Southern States war only. That would depend on the circumstances. For instance: a) Is WWI occurring as OTL in Europe, In which case I would say certainly not as Germany is too busy fighting the EP and would also have great difficulty getting much if anything past the allied blockade. Plus since attempting to do this would be an act of war, especially if it was sending troops rather than just equipment. As such that would both harden opinion in the US against the south, as they could be portrayed as agents of a foreign power and also make very likely an earlier US dow on Germany which would see it moblising earlier and probably with more effort. Once the south was defeated you would probably see substantial US forces, with some battle experience, arriving and engaging in battle say by some time in 1917. A very, very bad move by Germany.
b) If its not occurring but still tension as in OTL then it could prompt a response from Britain or that could be an alternative trigger for a conflict in Europe. However unless Germany sent significant levels of military forces or, probably more likely equipment its unlikely to greatly alter the substantial power imbalance between the two American factions. Steve
The ASB uses his powers to have all Southern states (who formed the first CSA in 1861) in the United States succeeded from the United States in 1915.
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stevep
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Post by stevep on Apr 26, 2020 14:22:25 GMT
That would depend on the circumstances. For instance: a) Is WWI occurring as OTL in Europe, In which case I would say certainly not as Germany is too busy fighting the EP and would also have great difficulty getting much if anything past the allied blockade. Plus since attempting to do this would be an act of war, especially if it was sending troops rather than just equipment. As such that would both harden opinion in the US against the south, as they could be portrayed as agents of a foreign power and also make very likely an earlier US dow on Germany which would see it moblising earlier and probably with more effort. Once the south was defeated you would probably see substantial US forces, with some battle experience, arriving and engaging in battle say by some time in 1917. A very, very bad move by Germany.
b) If its not occurring but still tension as in OTL then it could prompt a response from Britain or that could be an alternative trigger for a conflict in Europe. However unless Germany sent significant levels of military forces or, probably more likely equipment its unlikely to greatly alter the substantial power imbalance between the two American factions. Steve
The ASB uses his powers to have all Southern states (who formed the first CSA in 1861) in the United States succeeded from the United States in 1915.
Well if that means all southerns, even if excluding blacks give automatic and total loyalty to the new CSA then that would be a serious problem. They would still lose I suspect but it could be very, very bloody. If it loyalty to the new south but not an insane level of fanaticism so they will give up when defeated it would be a lot less savage but still going to cause a hell of a lot of chaos and confusion.
Also if it includes all southerns would it include Woodrow_Wilson, the current President? While he was briefly Governor of New Jersey in 1911-13 he was from and spent the majority of his life in the south. In fact the 1st southern to become President since the CW and I think the last one before Jimmy Carter. Also while liberal in a number of other ways he seems to have been a staunch racist. Having the siting President join/lead this new rebellion, would cause some political complications.
I'm not sure this would necessarily link into the current WWI, although I think Britain and France would give at least political support to the north, as they want a healthy and friendly US not one divided by a new war.
Other than having to raise forces to put down this rebellion the other big impact would be the disruption of economic activity as a lot of the mid-west area uses the Mississippi-Missouri basin for transportation of especially bulk goods and the southern section of this is now blocked as its in rebel hands. Railways can take up some of the slack and will have been used for trasportation to the east coast anyway, but they will be dearer and that will mean opportunity losses elsewhere.
After the defeat of the south a lot of the northerners will be very confused and angry that their defeated opponents can give no clear reason why they suddenly went for independence in this way.
Steve
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Zyobot
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Post by Zyobot on Apr 28, 2020 2:24:15 GMT
‘Abe Lincoln Becomes Babe Lincoln’. As in, Lincoln gets ISOTed to 2020 as a smoking hot young supermodel.
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lordroel
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Post by lordroel on Apr 28, 2020 2:41:25 GMT
‘Abe Lincoln Becomes Babe Lincoln’. As in, Lincoln gets ISOTed to 2020 as a smoking hot young supermodel. Well that is going to be a shock for him.
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Zyobot
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Post by Zyobot on Apr 28, 2020 2:57:49 GMT
‘Abe Lincoln Becomes Babe Lincoln’. As in, Lincoln gets ISOTed to 2020 as a smoking hot young supermodel. Well that is going to be a shock for him. I wonder which will shock him more: his sudden sex change (and “scandalously revealing clothing” to boot), or how he time-traveled to over a hundred and fifty years into the future.
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Zyobot
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Post by Zyobot on Apr 30, 2020 3:39:45 GMT
Following up on me doing this with Hitler, ‘Joe Stalin Meets His ATL Fascist Counterpart’.
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lordroel
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Post by lordroel on Apr 30, 2020 3:41:17 GMT
Following up on me doing this with Hitler, ‘Joe Stalin Meets His ATL Fascist Counterpart’. And both will be evil man i can presume.
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Zyobot
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Post by Zyobot on Apr 30, 2020 3:49:32 GMT
Following up on me doing this with Hitler, ‘Joe Stalin Meets His ATL Fascist Counterpart’. And both will be evil man i can presume. That’s a no-brainer. We already have confirmation that OTL Red Stalin was a murderous and iron-fisted despot; having him become a fascist instead would still bring out these traits in him due to how fascism is ideologically violent, suppressive and characterized by a rigid, top-down social order—something that someone as ruthless and power-hungry as Stalin would take advantage of. Actually, depending on the precise direction that he and whatever movement he aligns himself with takes place, could we see a fascist Russia with a fascist Stalin at the helm? If so, then I fear his regime would wind up at least as brutal and destructive as that of his OTL counterpart. Though whether fascist economic policies would prove less cack-handed (but more outwardly crony-corporatist), I don’t know.
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lordroel
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Post by lordroel on Apr 30, 2020 9:45:23 GMT
Instead of the the beer hall putsch of 1923 with weapons it becomes a drinking game with the last person standing ruling Germany.
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Zyobot
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Post by Zyobot on Apr 30, 2020 16:22:31 GMT
Instead of the the beer hall putsch of 1923 with weapons it becomes a drinking game with the last person standing ruling Germany. How would Hitler fare in a drinking contest? I’m guessing that some research concerning his dietary habits has been done, albeit more restricted to his ‘Fuhrer years’ IOTL (meaning that thirty-something Hitler might be rather different than his 1930s/40s self in this regard).
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stevep
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Post by stevep on Apr 30, 2020 16:33:57 GMT
Instead of the the beer hall putsch of 1923 with weapons it becomes a drinking game with the last person standing ruling Germany. How would Hitler fare in a drinking contest? I’m guessing that some research concerning his dietary habits has been done, albeit more restricted to his ‘Fuhrer years’ IOTL (meaning that thirty-something Hitler might be rather different than his 1930s/40s self in this regard).
Well he might not have the pretty strong views on being a vegetarian yet and not sure about his views on alcohol at the time. However he's fairly small in statue so he should have less capacity that a larger man with more body mass.
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lordroel
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Post by lordroel on Apr 30, 2020 16:37:09 GMT
What if every male in the world starting to where a boot like the one Vermin Supreme wears.
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Zyobot
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Post by Zyobot on Apr 30, 2020 16:57:07 GMT
What if every male in the world starting to where a boot like the one Vermin Supreme wears. So what, only women/girls are left not looking ridiculous (though men wearing 'head-boots' for a while will render the public desensitized after a few more years and decades)?
Suddenly, Vermin Supreme's iconic look isn't so unique anymore. Though his habits, viewpoints and deadpan trolling would probably remain special for him, per the stated specifics of this scenario.
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